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-   -   Official VR Headset discussion (http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=34008998)

aviphysics Mar 19, 2014 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaJMasta (Post 1337467472)
It's taking a while...

Hopefully there's still potential for an end of 2014 release, but the fact that there's a second dev kit announced like this doesn't suggest to me that they're making all of their deadlines.

Sure you want the devs to be using complete hardware, but still, this project is taking longer than I would have expected from all the hype and early demos.

They call it a "dev kit", but it is more like pre-release beta/alpha hardware. They just call it a "dev-kit" so people don't buy it with the expectation that it will be plug and play.

BTW, anyone can order one. Would totally do it, if I didn't have other things going on right now.
https://www.oculusvr.com/order/

jolle Mar 19, 2014 12:48 PM

Well they ARE dev kits, you get one if you want to make a Rift game, or add support for Rift to your existing game.
But theyīre not stopping curious people from just getting one to check out techdemos and Skyrim hacks and whatnots... all those Unity "things" people are putting out.
And I suppose there are some "proper" games with support out there already, like TF2 if I dont remember wrong?
But still, Dev kit is a appropriate term Iīd say.

DaJMasta Mar 19, 2014 12:54 PM

Yeah, that's exactly what a dev kit is. The hardware, sometimes with some debugging modifications and workflow enhancements, along with a software suite and some level of technical support.

The kickstarter 'dev kit' was a gimped prototype build that didn't match any of the final features, though it did come with the proper support.

Cyko Mar 19, 2014 01:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _TiTaNiuM (Post 1337467437)
Anyone? Anyone?

Pre-ordered it. I have a DK1 already and it's pretty fantastic (could be improved upon of course). Looking forward to what this release will bring.

Sundance Kid V2 Mar 19, 2014 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _TiTaNiuM (Post 1337467588)
Is it though? What's a good gaming monitor cost? 250-300. What's a midrange graphics card cost? 250-350. What does a next gen console cost? 400-500. I think the price point is right on for what you're getting honestly.

I agree... it could be more expensive example $500+.

$300 is not too bad... but if it is worth it then I'll buy it!

_TiTaNiuM Mar 19, 2014 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cyko (Post 1337467696)
Pre-ordered it. I have a DK1 already and it's pretty fantastic (could be improved upon of course). Looking forward to what this release will bring.

what all have you been able to do with it? is there anything that supports it currently or is it mostly half-assed right now?

jolle Mar 19, 2014 02:26 PM

Followup on resolution, just ran into this bit:
http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/19/55...it-2-announced
Quote:

The 1080p OLED panel still isn't high enough a resolution to avoid jagged edges — Oculus says the consumer version will have even higher resolution

night Mar 19, 2014 02:31 PM


bill dennison Mar 19, 2014 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jolle (Post 1337467734)
Followup on resolution, just ran into this bit:
http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/19/55...it-2-announced

shoot for 3840 × 2160 :drool:

http://gamerant.com/oculus-rift-4k-resolution/

BababooeyHTJ Mar 19, 2014 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jolle (Post 1337467734)
Followup on resolution, just ran into this bit:
http://www.theverge.com/2014/3/19/55...it-2-announced


Nice, this is what I was hoping for.

bill dennison Mar 19, 2014 06:12 PM

Quote:

Oculus won't commit to a release date for the consumer version, except to say that it will be before the end of next year
http://www.pcgamer.com/2014/03/19/oc...t-2-announced/
last year it was by end of 2114 and now 2015 :hmm:


the retail version will come out about the same time as star citizen in 2020 :bleh:

Omega53 Mar 19, 2014 07:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill dennison (Post 1337467927)
http://www.pcgamer.com/2014/03/19/oc...t-2-announced/
last year it was by end of 2114 and now 2015 :hmm:


the retail version will come out about the same time as star citizen in 2020 :bleh:

Star citizen with oculus rift = my dream of living out star wars in real life

YellowBeard Mar 19, 2014 08:24 PM

Pre-ordered. Also this thread just got banished to Purgatory. WTH?

SirBaron Mar 19, 2014 09:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bill dennison (Post 1337467927)
http://www.pcgamer.com/2014/03/19/oc...t-2-announced/
last year it was by end of 2114 and now 2015 :hmm:


the retail version will come out about the same time as star citizen in 2020 :bleh:

Yeah but if they released it, you same people would complain it's rushed to market missing features, or very poorly done.

Do we want a EA style release.

_TiTaNiuM Mar 19, 2014 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by YellowBeard (Post 1337468030)
Pre-ordered. Also this thread just got banished to Purgatory. WTH?

sure seems like it. may people never see it ever again.

SirBaron Mar 20, 2014 01:53 AM

See what?

General Lee Mar 20, 2014 06:33 AM

I can't wait until they release a finished, polished product. I want to play Titanfall or (depending on release dates) Titanfall 2. I know they got it working with Mirror's Edge, but imagine a game like Titanfall with this thing. Wall-running and other parkour movement with intense combat situations and piloting a Titan with this would be awesome.

I already find myself wanting to punch something whenever I smack people with my Titan, this would probably have me knocking my monitor over. :lol:

jolle Mar 20, 2014 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by General Lee (Post 1337468299)
I can't wait until they release a finished, polished product. I want to play Titanfall or (depending on release dates) Titanfall 2. I know they got it working with Mirror's Edge, but imagine a game like Titanfall with this thing. Wall-running and other parkour movement with intense combat situations and piloting a Titan with this would be awesome.

I already find myself wanting to punch something whenever I smack people with my Titan, this would probably have me knocking my monitor over. :lol:

I think fast paced shooters might be less then ideal for VR.
Might depend on how you manage rotating your character + VR tracking data, but the demos Iīve tried I seem to recall using analog stick to "move the camera" and the tracking is added ontop of that.
So flicking around with a mouse, twitch shooting etc.. could be disorienting and possibly nausiating..

Not thatīve tried, and even if I had the now dubbed DK1 pair was less then ideal in many ways.

A more slow paced mech game could be pretty damn epic though, got the sense of vertigo using the DK1 pair in some tech demos, going close to edges and such, and you get a very tangible sense of scale on everything compared to viewing a 3d world on a monitor.
So sitting up in a mech cockpit could be a pretty awesome experience in itself, just by sitting there.

BababooeyHTJ Mar 20, 2014 08:33 AM

Might not be too bad. I enjoyed painkiller in 3d. Hard reset and shadow warrior were also very good.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

jolle Mar 20, 2014 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BababooeyHTJ (Post 1337468348)
Might not be too bad. I enjoyed painkiller in 3d. Hard reset and shadow warrior were also very good.

Itīs not the stereoscopic part, if thatīs what you mean by "in 3d".
Itīs about motion sickness, where what you see doesnt correspond to how your brain knows your head is moving.
I think itīs worse with alot of mouse twitching when youīre "in the world".. so to speak. (if your head movement is additive ontop of the mouse movement, which I assume would be the case since you dont want to rotate 360 degrees in your chair, for several reasons)

Watching a screen through sterescopic glasses still has a lot of fixed world points outside of the monitor edges, so your brain knows YOUīRE not moving.
With a VR set there are no fixed points, there is only the virtual world in view.

Going OP flashpoint might be a decent way to handle it, but thatīs not great for twitch shooting anyway.
But essentially you move the crosshair freely within a deadzone, and when you go outside the deadzone, you start rotating the character.
That way your character is static when you aim around inside the deadzone, and the camera is only influenced by your head movement.

Well, I cant be sure, I only tried the DK1 with a controller in "walk around and take it easy" demos.
But in worst case scenario, those kinds of games might still be kinda awesome using a VR set for display only, not using the sensors?
Or itīs fine anyway, I dunno.

BababooeyHTJ Mar 20, 2014 02:59 PM

I never really thought about that. I see where that could be an issue if the vr is that convincing.

jolle Mar 20, 2014 04:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BababooeyHTJ (Post 1337468690)
I never really thought about that. I see where that could be an issue if the vr is that convincing.

The worst thing you could do with DK1 is look down, and rotate your head, as I understand it.
Since it doesnt track position, and when you lean forward your head moves forward a bit, while the camera (provided the game doesnt supply a "spine approximation") just pivots in place, and then rotates in place.
The disconnect there from what your brain knows itīs doing, and what you see, will induce motion sickness.
That type of thing is solved with the camera tracking the IR leds on the DK2 kit though, it gives positional tracking as I understand it.

But I would assume the problem resurfaces if you slave the camera (with head tracking) under a mouse input and twitch around like a CS player.

SirBaron Mar 21, 2014 12:08 AM

The only way you could help with that beaides getting used to it, would be a 120hz+ screen, the more fluid it is the more natural it would look, as like the brain it self anything that moves too fast is blurred via motion blur.

But then you'd have a 4k 3d, 120hz screen that would make my pc wet it self.

jolle Mar 21, 2014 04:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirBaron (Post 1337469052)
The only way you could help with that beaides getting used to it, would be a 120hz+ screen, the more fluid it is the more natural it would look, as like the brain it self anything that moves too fast is blurred via motion blur.

But then you'd have a 4k 3d, 120hz screen that would make my pc wet it self.

They mentioned aiming for 90hz with the consumer version in some interview, apparently thatīs where you NEED to go. (DK2 is 75hz)
I THINK the 90hz limit is for the strobing caused by low persistance displays, which from what I understand means the pixels are only lit briefly then go black until the next frame is displayed. (if you do this at low refresh rates itīll probably be noticably strobing/flickering)
Which ofcource cuts down motionblur and such.

CurrentlyPissed Mar 21, 2014 08:29 AM

I really want to. But I know I'll buy the final product so just trying to hold out.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk

YellowBeard Mar 21, 2014 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurrentlyPissed (Post 1337469259)
I really want to. But I know I'll buy the final product so just trying to hold out.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Tapatalk

Eh, I figure if I get most of a year out of it before the consumer version comes out I'll be happy. That and I'm kinda excited about all the development behind it with the other motion technology at the moment.

badboy Mar 21, 2014 09:31 AM

Im excited about all the porn games :drool:

It will just be hard to aim with the oculus on the head... need to use a sock instead of paper :bleh:

acroig Mar 21, 2014 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chubz (Post 1337467542)
I'm psyched about the Rift, but I'm going to wait until it's completely finished before ordering one.

The last thing I want to do is spoil my first-ever VR experience with a prototype intended for developers.

Same here.

aviphysics Mar 21, 2014 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jolle (Post 1337467627)
Well they ARE dev kits, you get one if you want to make a Rift game, or add support for Rift to your existing game.
But they´re not stopping curious people from just getting one to check out techdemos and Skyrim hacks and whatnots... all those Unity "things" people are putting out.
And I suppose there are some "proper" games with support out there already, like TF2 if I dont remember wrong?
But still, Dev kit is a appropriate term I´d say.

While it fits some classification of a Dev-Kit, it is definitely an alpha or beta version. It both lacks the full set of features of the final version and has some number of bugs in the design. TBH, I am not really sure what makes it a Dev-kit.

The thing is, it is just a piece of hardware and it doesn't seem right to call every piece of hardware I can write software for a devkit. Normally a devkit has features above and beyond what the consumer version of the hardware has in order to make development easier. The Rift kits don't do this. Classifying it as beta hardware just makes more sense to me.

BTW, there are a bunch of commercial games (i.e. not tech demos) that support Rift. I think the number of proper games might even be more than currently available for PS4. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of...s_Rift_support. I have been told that Hawken with Rift is amazing

jolle Mar 21, 2014 03:52 PM

Well early console devkits have been all sorts of cobbled together machines, or straight up PCs and whatnot, they were still devkits even if they werent the final specs.
Sure, it´s not a post release devkit as a PS3 devkit you would get today..
It´s not in it´s final state, and the final specs for everything arent 100% set, and it´s not a retail product.

But these are out there with the main intent for developers to use them to get their VR games or support going, not for consumers to buy as a retail product, which I suppose is why they´re called devkits.
You get them to develop VR support, sure there isnt a bunch of switches, buttons, mysterious ports and whatnot, but I rather think that´s because you dont need them.
All you need probably supplied by the SDK, which might not be available with the retail version? ( who knows?), and reading the sensor output.
Any rendering issues is solved on the game engine side, all you´re doing after that is outputting a display signal.

A PS3 reference kit has all those knobs, bells and whistles because it´s a complex machine running complex code.

Well, either way it´s just a question of definitions, it doesnt matter.. it is what it is.


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