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Old Jan 13, 2004, 11:42 AM   #1
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raydog1
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Default For those with Flat Panel Monitor Problems. . .

I did a little experiment yesterday.

The setups:

Dell Dimension 4550
2.53 GHz P4
512 MB RAM
Windows XP Pro
Dell 1800FP Flat Panel Monitor
Radeon 9600 Pro

Home Build
Nforce2 mboard
Athlon XP 2800 (Barton)
512 MB RAM
Windows 2000 Pro
Dell 17inch CRT
Radeon 9500 Pro

Originally I had the Radeon 9600 Pro in the Dell using a DVI connection for the FP. As I've reported before, the monitor would lose signal just as Windows would start up when using CAT 3.9 or 3.10 causing me to perform a hard reboot, start in safe mode, and unistall the drivers. CAT 3.9 and 3.10 always worked fine on the home build. Other people reported this problem in this forum, but no one could find a solution and ATI reps were eerily silent about the problem. This led us to believe that the recent CATs have problems with flat panels using a DVI connection.

But I wanted to see if maybe it was also a Radeon 9600 problem. So I switched cards and did a fresh driver install using CAT 3.10. Keep in mind there have never been any Nvidia drivers on either machine.

I found that CAT 3.10 works perfectly with the flat panel and the Radeon 9500. I played Unreal Tournament 2003 and Call of Duty for a couple of hours just to test it. I had zero problems.

So what about the Radeon 9600 on the PC with the CRT? Again, zero problems.

If you're having this problem, please comment. Also, any ATI experts, please tell me if ATI recognizes this as a bug. I've sent 2 reports to ATI on this problem with no reponse other than a "Thanks. We've received your report."

Last edited by raydog1 : Jan 23, 2004 at 06:44 PM.
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Old Jan 13, 2004, 05:48 PM   #2
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I am using an Acer 17inch TFT display and it has had no problems related to the GFX card.

I say this because I have a area of discolouration on the screen that I need to get sorted.

But I am unable to use the digital out because of monitor limitations, the VGA works fine.
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Old Jan 13, 2004, 07:10 PM   #3
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My system is in my sig, and I have had no problems whatsoever. Is this only with the 9600 or other cards as well?
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Old Jan 13, 2004, 07:28 PM   #4
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I had that exact problem with my wife's 9800NP and her Dell 18.1 FP monitor. Using the DVI cables, on cold startup, the monitor wouldn't turn on. Had to reboot it. Then it would connect. Acted like cable was unplugged. Same thing would happen when monitor would go to sleep. It wouldn't wake back up. I changed to the analog cables. Problem solved. She's using Dell drivers. Not sure of the version. I think it's a video card problem/driver problem. Maybe a problem with the DVI connection on the video card. Anyway, using analog cables fixed it. Pic looks just as good with the analog cables anyway.
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Old Jan 14, 2004, 01:05 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally posted by blackgoat
My system is in my sig, and I have had no problems whatsoever. Is this only with the 9600 or other cards as well?
Those of us who have reported this have been using the 9600 to my knowledge except for the 9800 reported in the above post.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 12:19 AM   #6
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I have had this problem a bit (Mitsubishi DV172B/Radeon 9700 Pro).

It doesn't seem to have happened since 3.10, but i did find a mini fix for the problem.

If you can force a resolution change, it comes back to life. All i did was [Windows]+R (Run), then ran the dos prompt (cmd). Pressing alt+enter causes the dos box to go into full screen mode, 72 Hz, and brought the monitor from it's slumber. You might wanna give this a try the next time it happens. Not much of a fix, but it's a work around, none the less.

BJ
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 11:13 AM   #7
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Unhappy

I have the same problem with a 9200se. VGA works fine but a soon as DVI is connected, loosing signal at windows login screen.
I was using a TI4200 before and had no such problems.
It has to be a driver issue because windows standard drivers works at 1280x1024.
I'm using a Belinea 19" TFT (it's a german branch, using samsung panels). Resolution 1280x1024 @ 75Hz
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 01:38 PM   #8
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9800 here.

NEC 17" LCD, using DVI connection (as in sig).

No problems whatsoever.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 04:22 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xander
9800 here.

NEC 17" LCD, using DVI connection (as in sig).

No problems whatsoever.
It's good that many of you aren't having problems. But I ask again only those who are having this problem to comment. I have no doubt that most people are doing fine with CAT 3.9 and 3.10 (as I'm doing fine now after switching cards ). I'm just hoping that there is a common thread with those of us having problems so that maybe. . . maybe ATI will address this.

At first, I thought it was isolated to the drivers, FP monitors using DVI, and Radeon 9600s. Apparently it's not isolated to the 9600 model. So keep posting if you are having similar problems.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 04:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by Optimus420
I have had this problem a bit (Mitsubishi DV172B/Radeon 9700 Pro).

It doesn't seem to have happened since 3.10, but i did find a mini fix for the problem.

If you can force a resolution change, it comes back to life. All i did was [Windows]+R (Run), then ran the dos prompt (cmd). Pressing alt+enter causes the dos box to go into full screen mode, 72 Hz, and brought the monitor from it's slumber. You might wanna give this a try the next time it happens. Not much of a fix, but it's a work around, none the less.

BJ
I began to suspect that the drivers were putting the monitor into a resolution that it couldn't handle causing it to "go to sleep." Good troubleshooting!
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 06:29 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by raydog1
I began to suspect that the drivers were putting the monitor into a resolution that it couldn't handle causing it to "go to sleep." Good troubleshooting!
I was merely adding my information.

Given the nature of the problem, it seems *very likely* that it is the monitor not handling something the ATI driver is doing.

As such, it would seem that the problem is going to vary by monitor - some LCDs will work, and I'd expect all LCDs of that make and model to work - and some LCDs won't work, and I'd expect all LCDs of that make and model to not work.

Information about who is working with what, then, will enable you to determine if this is the problem or if it is something else.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 07:35 PM   #12
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I'm having this problem as well, with a NEC 1760NX (DVI) and a (Sapphire) Radeon 9600. The problem started with the Cat 3.8s (IIRC - it was the the big "VPU recover" release), but I could still boot 1/4 of the time. With the 3.9s and 3.10s, however, the problem is consistent. I've installed these drivers on the fiancée's machine, who has the same video card but an LCD with an analogue connector - and of course everything works fine for her.

I've e-mailed ATI, but of course heard nothing... maybe I should visit HQ in person (it's not far from here) and pretend to be a Dell VP or something.

In any case, this had better be resolved soon or I will be "upgrading" to a GeForce as sure as ice is cold.

Thucydides

Last edited by Thucydides : Jan 15, 2004 at 07:37 PM.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 08:20 PM   #13
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I have the same LCD with no problems.

Have you tried a different DVI cable? (Different brand, too, if you can arrange it at the same time)
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 09:48 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thucydides
I'm having this problem as well, with a NEC 1760NX (DVI) and a (Sapphire) Radeon 9600. The problem started with the Cat 3.8s (IIRC - it was the the big "VPU recover" release), but I could still boot 1/4 of the time. With the 3.9s and 3.10s, however, the problem is consistent. I've installed these drivers on the fiancée's machine, who has the same video card but an LCD with an analogue connector - and of course everything works fine for her.

I've e-mailed ATI, but of course heard nothing... maybe I should visit HQ in person (it's not far from here) and pretend to be a Dell VP or something.

In any case, this had better be resolved soon or I will be "upgrading" to a GeForce as sure as ice is cold.

Thucydides
Yes! Yes! Exactly what I'm looking for. When mixing a 9600 and DVI, my system would boot about once every 3 or 4 tries. But when using analog. . .no probs. But it would consistently not boot with 3.10 no matter what. And just like you. . . nothing but the cold shoulder from ATI.

I was actually researching Nvidia 5700 FX prices online and looking to see how much my 9600 would go for on ebay LOL!!! Only when I switched cards and solved my probs did I decide to give ATI another chance. It's very frustrating though that everything worked perfectly with CATs 3.2-3.7 and then suddenly, a kick in the nuts starting with 3.8.
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Old Jan 15, 2004, 09:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xander
I was merely adding my information.

Given the nature of the problem, it seems *very likely* that it is the monitor not handling something the ATI driver is doing.

As such, it would seem that the problem is going to vary by monitor - some LCDs will work, and I'd expect all LCDs of that make and model to work - and some LCDs won't work, and I'd expect all LCDs of that make and model to not work.

Information about who is working with what, then, will enable you to determine if this is the problem or if it is something else.
I'm sorry if you think I was discounting your input. It's just that this thread could quickly turn into a "Mine works fine. . . you must be on crack" thread. I'm sure this thread could be filled very quickly with people who's LCDs and Radeons work great together. After all, my 9600 works perfectly with CAT 3.7 and my 9500 works with everything. So I'm positive it's a driver issue. I just want everyone with this problem to tell their story so we (and hopefully ATI) can see how widespread this is.

But thank you for trying to help us with this problem.
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Old Jan 16, 2004, 12:18 PM   #16
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I think, this has something to do with login screen using different resolution than desktop. It might get resolution from either Administrator or guest account (Not entirely sure about this). To login as administrator on XP, press and hold Alt+Ctrl+Del on login screen. (or was it alt+ctrl+instert )

Btw. I've never had problems with DVI
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Old Jan 18, 2004, 03:15 PM   #17
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Same problem. Radeon 9600 Pro, 2.6 GHz P4, ABIT IS7.

No problems up until 3.8.

Using 3.10 and Samsung SyncMaster 152T LCD by DVI.

Monitor turns off at log-in screen and computer restarts.

Incidently, I have found a work-around; having a VGA cable plugged into the card with the DVI cable makes the DVI connection work; this can be done by hot-plugging the DVI cable while in VGA mode (in Windows... it was one of the fixes in the release notes actually... the hot-plugging DVI i think)... and then restarting the computer with both the VGA and DVI cable in, and monitor connected via DVI.

Has worked flawlessly for me, although having just completed a clean install of Windows, my performance seems to be sub-par from what it previously was.

ATI has not made me a happy customer.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 11:26 AM   #18
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may sound silly, but have any of you guys tried changing the power connection to your vid cards (if applicable) and perhaps the power supply to the pc itself? Sounds to me like some sort of signalling problem... I know that on my 9700Pro, even with a 520W Vantec Stealth PS, I have to have everything connected a certain way or I get no video signal, and have issues booting. I have found a reliable set up now, so my PC boots every time.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 03:06 PM   #19
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Catalyst 4.1 does not resolve the issue. Back to 3.7, again...

For those who insist on telling us their DVI works fine, please DON'T BOTHER unless you have a Radeon 9600. The problem is almost certainly restricted to this particular card. And it IS a driver issue, NOTHING TO DO WITH HARDWARE, seeing as a simple driver revert solves all. Thank you.

Look, we have to get ATI's attention on this. I'm now stuck with a four month old driver - that's how long this BS has been going on for. I want to play KOTOR properly. If the next release doesn't fix this issue, I'm dumping ATI - and I've recommended them for years to a lot of people... that will stop too.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 05:09 PM   #20
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I experienced this problem too. 9600 pro hooked up to a Hitachi CML174 using DVI.

Using 3.10's the logon screen would not show on DVI-out. I had to connect the VGA cable from my LCD to my graphics card then reboot. After I did this, the login screen has worked fine with DVI. It only messed up the first time until i hooked up the VGA cable. This makes it VERY annoying to install new drivers (which is why i haven't installed the 4.1's yet)

Last edited by wadey : Jan 19, 2004 at 05:23 PM.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 05:34 PM   #21
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No problems here, too. Using a Multi Monitor Setup with an Philips 109B CRT and an Iiyama AS4314UT.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 06:18 PM   #22
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Default This thread most helpful.....

Man am I glad I ran across this thread. I have been trying to get my NEC LCD1760NX to work with its digital port. I have an ATI 9600pro with the NEC and have only once been able to see anything, at bootup before it told me there was no signal on the port. ever since it will not recognise any signal is present at all.

At first I thought that something was wrong with the monitor, but works perfectly on analog. I may try hooking up both to see if I can get it to work that way.

Thanks All, maybe there is hope yet.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 07:21 PM   #23
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Yeah, i just hook up both for the first boot after installing new drivers. Then i can just have the DVI plugged in after that.

How do we get ATi to acknowledge this bug?! A few driver updates have gone by and still no fix.
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 07:59 PM   #24
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Hey Guys

I have a 9600 Pro (BBA) and I've noticed in the Advanced Display Settings, Options Tab, that Alternate DVI Operational Mode is always selected by default with a fresh instal of Cat Drivers. If you right click Alt Dvi Op Mode and select "what's this" you get the following explanation: Enable this option if you are experiencing display corruption on your DVI flat panel.
After a clean instal of drivers I always de-select that option. I've often wondered why it is selected by default. I use a CRT monitor so I can't test the theory but could this be the cause of your probs with DVI panels?
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Old Jan 19, 2004, 09:57 PM   #25
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Same problem here w/my Dell FP2001 and DVI connection as Thucydides reports. Starting w/Catalyst 3.8, the driver won't initialize when only the DVI port is in use. No combination of any settings on any of the ATI Control Panel tabs can fix it. Analog is fine.

Here's one tip that makes it a little easier to live with, assuming your FP has an analog port as well as DVI -- connect the analog port to the VGA output of the 9600. The problem only occurs when *only* the DVI port is used, so if you can connect the analog VGA port of the 9600 to something (any monitor will do and does not even have to be plugged in), no more DVI probs.

Steve
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Old Jan 20, 2004, 12:17 AM   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by Braham
may sound silly, but have any of you guys tried changing the power connection to your vid cards (if applicable) and perhaps the power supply to the pc itself? Sounds to me like some sort of signalling problem... I know that on my 9700Pro, even with a 520W Vantec Stealth PS, I have to have everything connected a certain way or I get no video signal, and have issues booting. I have found a reliable set up now, so my PC boots every time.
No power supply connection is needed for a 9600. But thanks for your efforts.
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Old Jan 20, 2004, 12:28 AM   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Thucydides
Catalyst 4.1 does not resolve the issue. Back to 3.7, again...

For those who insist on telling us their DVI works fine, please DON'T BOTHER unless you have a Radeon 9600. The problem is almost certainly restricted to this particular card. And it IS a driver issue, NOTHING TO DO WITH HARDWARE, seeing as a simple driver revert solves all. Thank you.

Look, we have to get ATI's attention on this. I'm now stuck with a four month old driver - that's how long this BS has been going on for. I want to play KOTOR properly. If the next release doesn't fix this issue, I'm dumping ATI - and I've recommended them for years to a lot of people... that will stop too.
I agree completely. That's why I started this thread.

And I had a feeling that there would be many "My flat panel & Radeon works great. . . all of your problems have NOTHING to do with ATI or Catalyst" responses. This forum is infamous for flames.

But this is so obviously a driver problem. There is no way anyone can deny that. We all seem to have been doing fine from as far back as 3.2 up to 3.7 (or 3.8 for a few of us) and then BAM!!! Houston we have a problem. Whenever it is brought up, we get no responses from any of the posters with ATI logos or "Catalyst Tester" as their avatars and the other responses are usually suggestions that don't really help because it's not so much a problem with our set-ups but more so a problem with Cat 3.8, 3.9, 3.10, etc. What's worse is that none of the change logs even suggest that ATI considers this a problem. And has anyone reported this to ATI and received a helpful response? If so, please tell us that they are at least looking into it. Heck, at least LIE to us and tell us that ATI is looking into it.
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Old Jan 20, 2004, 11:50 AM   #28
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Did you guys all submit a bug report to ATI?
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Old Jan 20, 2004, 09:49 PM   #29
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Same problem here.

AIW 9800 Pro (Sapphire)
CAT 3.10
Dell Dimension 8100
768MB RAM
SB Audigy2 Platinum
Etc...

I am having the same problems. I have never gotten the monitor to power up with DVI, nor has the ATI control panel ever shown the DVI cable as connected. At first I thought it was a monitor problem, but uninstalling the ATI drivers and running purely with the standard Microsoft VGA drivers works fine with DVI. The monitor works on VGA, but the image quality suffers. NOTE, this is a 9800, so the problem still appears to be there.
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Old Jan 20, 2004, 10:19 PM   #30
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Hi everyone..just like to say I have the exact problem as all of you.. I have a Viewsonic VP171B LCD running into my Built by ATI 9600 PRO via DVI. I just recently installed Catalyst 4.1's, and have gotten it to boot a few times successfully, without it hanging at the windows boot screen...my solution is just to leave my computer on 24/7 without restarting it Hopefully ATi will clue in and have this issue resolved in the next set of drivers..(yeah right..)
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