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Old Feb 19, 2008, 09:51 AM   #1
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Razeus
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Default Quotes for hard drive storage space are starting to get out of hand

So I'm in the market for a 1 tera hard drive. After some look see, I see that it's really only ~930 gigs of real estate to use. Now, I understand why there is a difference between what's on the box and what I actually get, but seriously, we need a new way of determining space. I mean that's 70 gigs chopped off right there! That's indeed alot of space I could be using
What's next 2 tera's only affording me 1.75 tera's (missing 250 gigs!)???



/rant over.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 09:54 AM   #2
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Just how big, exactly, is your porn collection?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 09:59 AM   #3
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Theres a 7% less actual space then is says on the box. Next time keep that number in mind

The formula is 1-(1000^3) / (1024^3)
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:01 AM   #4
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You're not losing anything.
You got 1,000,000,000,000 bytes did you not?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:07 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pixie69 View Post
Just how big, exactly, is your porn collection?
not as big as magicknights.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:30 AM   #6
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Look at the General Hardware important info sticky, under 'Hard Drives'


EDIT - I thought you were good with numbers and stuff. and junk.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:37 AM   #7
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I agree with the orig poster, does this problem apply to Flash and SSD's?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:38 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
Look at the General Hardware important info sticky, under 'Hard Drives'


EDIT - I thought you were good with numbers and stuff. and junk.
i am to an extent, but that doesn't mean i'm happy with the way things are being advertised as we move up into higher capacities.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 10:39 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Idle Wild View Post
I agree with the orig poster, does this problem apply to Flash and SSD's?
No.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:19 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by Razeus View Post
i am to an extent, but that doesn't mean i'm happy with the way things are being advertised as we move up into higher capacities.
You misunderstand the problem. The problem is all the stupid programs that keep clinging on to kilo-, mega-, giga-, tera-, etc byte as powers of 2. While in science these prefixes denote a power of 10.
A gigawatt is a gigawatt just like a gigabyte is a gigabyte. You are getting what is advertised, that is 10^12 bytes.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:27 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
You misunderstand the problem. The problem is all the stupid programs that keep clinging on to kilo-, mega-, giga-, tera-, etc byte as powers of 2.
the prefixes arent different, its just a matter of bits vs bytes.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:31 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
You misunderstand the problem. The problem is all the stupid programs that keep clinging on to kilo-, mega-, giga-, tera-, etc byte as powers of 2. While in science these prefixes denote a power of 10.
A gigawatt is a gigawatt just like a gigabyte is a gigabyte. You are getting what is advertised, that is 10^12 bytes.
Lmao, you have no idea why its to the power of 2 huh? It's more of a hardware issue
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:31 AM   #13
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I vaguely recall reading that all hard drive manufactures are required to indicate the actual formatted capacity on the packaging.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:45 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
You misunderstand the problem. The problem is all the stupid programs that keep clinging on to kilo-, mega-, giga-, tera-, etc byte as powers of 2. While in science these prefixes denote a power of 10.
Yeah, these stupid programs! Powers of 2?? I mean, you'd think that computers operated in binary or something.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:50 AM   #15
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except for the fact that kilo means thousand, mega means million, giga means billion, and tera means trillion. computers aren't exempt. if i'm in the market for a 1TB hard drive, should i expect anything other than 1 trillion bytes?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:51 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryoko View Post
except for the fact that kilo means thousand, mega means million, giga means billion, and tera means trillion. computers aren't exempt. if i'm in the market for a 1TB hard drive, should i expect anything other than 1 trillion bytes?

kilo = 1000 in a base 10 system
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:52 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tisti View Post
Lmao, you have no idea why its to the power of 2 huh?
Enlighten me
Quote:
It's more of a hardware issue
Depends on what issue you're talking about exactly.
I'm on about consumers getting confused and thinking they somehow lost disk space.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:52 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phial View Post
the prefixes arent different, its just a matter of bits vs bytes.
Care to elaborate?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:54 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tisti View Post
kilo = 1000 in a base 10 system
binary = bits

base 10 = bytes.

if bytes were base 2, then kilo would be 8
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 11:55 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryoko View Post
binary = bits

base 10 = bytes.

if bytes were base 2, then kilo would be 8
What the hell?

1 byte = 8 bits

Edit:
Must say, I like this thread
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:01 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Firestorm_ATI View Post
Yeah, these stupid programs! Powers of 2?? I mean, you'd think that computers operated in binary or something.
Are you a computer? I'm a lot more comfortable with powers of 10 compared to powers of 2.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1,000,000,000,000 bytes, easy.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1024*1024*1024*1024 bytes errrr ah yes 1099511627776 bytes. Now there's an easy number.

There is no added value in using powers of 2 to represent file size or disk sizes, so why use it?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:04 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
Are you a computer? I'm a lot more comfortable with powers of 10 compared to powers of 2.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1,000,000,000,000 bytes, easy.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1024*1024*1024*1024 bytes errrr ah yes 1099511627776 bytes. Now there's an easy number.

There is no added value in using powers of 2 to represent file size or disk sizes, so why use it?
because microsoft uses it

we all know how standard microsoft is
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:05 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
Are you a computer? I'm a lot more comfortable with powers of 10 compared to powers of 2.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1,000,000,000,000 bytes, easy.
I got a terabyte drive, I got 1024*1024*1024*1024 bytes errrr ah yes 1099511627776 bytes. Now there's an easy number.

There is no added value in using powers of 2 to represent file size or disk sizes, so why use it?
NIST and IEEE 1541: powers of two = first 2 letters closest SI designation + bi.
kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera = 10^3, 10^6, 10^9, and 10^12
Kibi, Mebi, Gibi, Tebi= 2^10, 2^20, 2^30, and 2^40 respectively

1 terabtye=1x10^12 bytes
1 tebibyte=1x2^40 bytes

kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera, etc are SI prefices that unambiguously refer to powers of 10. Any other assumed definition are completely nonstandard, and used only in colloquial speech.

get it?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:12 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tisti View Post
Theres a 7% less actual space then is says on the box. Next time keep that number in mind

The formula is 1-(1000^3) / (1024^3)
right, but power of 3 is for giga. for tera you should use power of 4. that would be 10%.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:13 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
Enlighten me

Depends on what issue you're talking about exactly.
I'm on about consumers getting confused and thinking they somehow lost disk space.
Meh, someone else has done the enlightening...

Consumers confused? So what? I don't see a lot of complaning about it tbh
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:14 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XSBagage View Post
You misunderstand the problem. The problem is all the stupid programs that keep clinging on to kilo-, mega-, giga-, tera-, etc byte as powers of 2. While in science these prefixes denote a power of 10.
A gigawatt is a gigawatt just like a gigabyte is a gigabyte. You are getting what is advertised, that is 10^12 bytes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by seeker010 View Post
NIST and IEEE 1541: powers of two = first 2 letters closest SI designation + bi.
kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera = 10^3, 10^6, 10^9, and 10^12
Kibi, Mebi, Gibi, Tebi= 2^10, 2^20, 2^30, and 2^40 respectively

1 terabtye=1x10^12 bytes
1 tebibyte=1x2^40 bytes

kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera, etc are SI prefices that unambiguously refer to powers of 10. Any other assumed definition are completely nonstandard, and used only in colloquial speech.

get it?
Obviously I do not.

I do not bring up the kibi, mebi etc stuff because that only confuses people more. It isn't used by microsoft so try telling people it's that way when their computer tells them otherwise. First you have to establish that the computer is wrong, before you bring up the kibis and mebis
We already have Ryoko on board, he brought up M$.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:15 PM   #27
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Quote:
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Consumers confused? So what? I don't see a lot of complaning about it tbh
Did you read the OP?
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:16 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MaxSt View Post
right, but power of 3 is for giga. for tera you should use power of 4. that would be 10%.
Ah, indeed it is. I guess Razeus is lucky that the drive manufacturers didn't take that into consideration. He would have a 900GB drive right now if they did


Quote:
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Did you read the OP?
It's a drop in the ocean
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 12:16 PM   #29
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some of you guys didn't notice it, but seeker ended the thread a little while ago.
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Old Feb 19, 2008, 03:42 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
Look at the General Hardware important info sticky, under 'Hard Drives'


EDIT - I thought you were good with numbers and stuff. and junk.

He's a finance guy, stick a dollar sign in front of the numbers and he'd be fine.
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