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Old Jan 14, 2010, 09:36 AM   #1
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drwright
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Default I am back to build/upgrade a new one!

Hi All. I have not upgraded mobo or cpu since 04/07 and I think I need to do that. I currently have a GIGABYTE GA-965P-S3 LGA 775 with a C2D E6400. I need help upgrading this combo.

My additional features which I have to keep in mind when upgrading are:

Powercolor 4850HD (which I want to upgrade soon but not yet)
4Gig GeIL DDR2 ULTRA PC6400 DDR2 800Mhz
1.5Tb SATA
Silverstone 650W PS
Antec 900 Case

Thanks for the help!
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 10:29 AM   #2
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Do you have a budget in mind? What are you doing on your PC that you would like to achieve quicker/better?
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 11:44 AM   #3
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well, the money is not too much of an issue, I can't go overboard but I would like to game a little better. That is all this machine is for. I know I could spend the money on a better GPU but I want to be sure it would not be throttled by the mobo/cpu combo
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 12:50 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwright View Post
I would like to game a little better. That is all this machine is for. I know I could spend the money on a better GPU but I want to be sure it would not be throttled by the mobo/cpu combo
Why not drop in a C2 Quad with a good HSF and do some OC and put the rest of the $ toward a 5850/5870?

EDIT: $299 for a 5850 with free shipping:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...C2C-_-14161302
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 01:58 PM   #5
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I just cannot bring myself to spend that much money on a GPU and have it be mid level in 6 months. I would rather spend less on a GPU that is mid level now.
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 02:06 PM   #6
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I think you should wait until mid year, right now you've got a balanced system and any upgrade you do youre gonna bottleneck or not get a benefit from really.

2 options - check for which quads drop into your mobo (might not be any) and swap in a 5830 (coming soon)
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 02:11 PM   #7
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I just cannot bring myself to spend that much money on a GPU and have it be mid level in 6 months. I would rather spend less on a GPU that is mid level now.
Sorry, I thought you said $ was not an issue. You could wait for a slower GPU, as Jim suggested or see what your mobo will take for a quad and get a 5870.
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Old Jan 14, 2010, 03:43 PM   #8
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I believe the P965 boards are mostly restricted to Kentsfield generation C2Q's, not sure if a Yorky will work or not.
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Old Jan 15, 2010, 06:20 PM   #9
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A 5850 won't way turn mid level in 6 months, unless one considers it already so for the 5870 .

Imo there're two "ideal" high-end systems now without "going overboard": modern Intel platform (1156 or 1366) or modern AMD platform (AM3), both with a 5850 . Intel is pricier but brings more processing power to encoding, rendering and some games. A 5870 on AMD platform isn't bad option for pure gaming (a 5870 with Intel starts to be a bit overboard, specially if it's only for gaming).

You could opt to upgrade in two steps. In such case you have a dilemma, because upgrading that platform is more necessary but upgrading the vcard brings an inmediate and more concrete benefit. Imo the motherboard is too old to drop a new processor, Kentsfield or Yorkfield.
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Old Feb 4, 2010, 11:14 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by acroig View Post
Sorry, I thought you said $ was not an issue. You could wait for a slower GPU, as Jim suggested or see what your mobo will take for a quad and get a 5870.
sorry, I did say that... *blush* ...to me $300 is an issue, specially when the wife would get mad at that amount on a video card... I have to buy this in pieces. thank you for the info though!!

thank you all for the info... I was afraid the mobo was getting a lilttle long in the tooth. I need to find a good mobo/cpu combo. I have not built an AMD system for myself yet but I have built them for others. Ima look if my mobo can support a quad, do that, and then see what I can plunk down on a gpu.

Last edited by drwright : Feb 4, 2010 at 11:17 AM.
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Old Feb 4, 2010, 11:18 AM   #11
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sorry, I did say that... *blush* ...to me $300 is an issue, specially when the wife would get mad at that amount on a video card... I have to buy this in pieces. thank you for the info though!!
NP, good luck with your build.
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Old Feb 4, 2010, 12:22 PM   #12
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well I looked up the cpus my mobo can support and I am off to price them:

Per New Egg:

Core™ 2 Quad Q9650 3.0 GHz 12MB Yorkfield: $329
Core™ 2 Quad Q9550 2.83GHz 12MB Yorkfield: $269
Core™ 2 Quad Q9450 2.66GHz 12MB Yorkfield: unavailable
Core™ 2 Quad Q9400 2.66GHz 6MB Yorkfield: $189
Core™ 2 Quad Q9300 2.50GHz 6MB Yorkfield: unavailable
Core™ 2 Quad Q8300 2.50GHz 4MB Yorkfield: $149
Core™ 2 Quad Q8200 2.33GHz 4MB Yorkfield: $183.99

Last edited by drwright : Feb 4, 2010 at 12:26 PM. Reason: prices
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Old Feb 4, 2010, 01:41 PM   #13
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You mentioned upgrading for the purpose of gaming. Is your e6400 oc'd at all? I don't see the quad improving your performance in many gaming situations to be honest. I'd rather drop $300 on a video card now, with a slight oc on the e6400 (3-3.2 should do nicely), than drop $300 on a new dead-end CPU which WILL be a bottleneck soon.
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Old Feb 5, 2010, 08:54 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
You mentioned upgrading for the purpose of gaming. Is your e6400 oc'd at all? I don't see the quad improving your performance in many gaming situations to be honest. I'd rather drop $300 on a video card now, with a slight oc on the e6400 (3-3.2 should do nicely), than drop $300 on a new dead-end CPU which WILL be a bottleneck soon.
I did have it ocd to 3.2 but I was having issues where it would shut down and reset itself. If I had a little more knowledge as what to fix I would keep it at 3.2

your suggestion is sound. I need to get some help getting a stable OC
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Old Feb 5, 2010, 01:31 PM   #15
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What's your OC process? How did you test? Did you check temps/voltages? etc
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Old Feb 11, 2010, 09:20 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
What's your OC process? How did you test? Did you check temps/voltages? etc
My mind told me I had asked about the OCing before so I searched my posts.

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33888061

I am going to give it a try again.

If you don't want to look at that thread, below are the settings I was using when the system reset itself.

Code:
CPU Clock Ratio- 8 <<<----CPU Multiplier
CPU Host Clock Control - [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz) [400] <<<----FSB Speed
System Voltage Control - [Manual] 
DDR2 OverVoltage Control - [+0.300V] <-- default is 1.8V, 1.8 + 0.3V = 2.1V
PCI-E OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability 
FSB OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
CPU voltage - E6400 = 1.35 (Normal CPU Vcore 1.3250V)
DRAM Timing Selectable - SPD -[Manual]
CAS Latency Time - 4
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay - 4
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay - 4 
Precharge Delay (tRAS)- 12
Thanks!

Last edited by drwright : Feb 11, 2010 at 09:21 AM. Reason: punctuation.
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Old Feb 11, 2010, 12:19 PM   #17
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You may need more vcore. WHat process did you follow to make sure it was stable with those settings? Have you checked the memory for stability? Have you checked your PSU voltages to see if it's delivering adequate/stable current to the system?
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Old Feb 11, 2010, 03:01 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
You may need more vcore. WHat process did you follow to make sure it was stable with those settings? Have you checked the memory for stability? Have you checked your PSU voltages to see if it's delivering adequate/stable current to the system?
Two instance of Prime 95 keeing the core at 100% workload for an hour, temps with ITAT not getting above 55C. How would I check the PSU voltages?
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Old Feb 11, 2010, 03:16 PM   #19
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Gigabyte should have some utility app for download on their site. Look up easy tune under the support section.

So P95 for an hour doesn't shut down your PC?
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 04:01 AM   #20
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Hit it with more voltage for sure, I think I had my E6600 at around 1.45 to be stable at 3.2/3.3. I'd try to find a cheap Q6600/6700 used. I got my Q6700 in August 2008 for I think $130-140ish when Q6600 was still over 200 new. Put the rest into a mid level card. Probably a good idea to wait till March for NV's new cards to come out in case they push ATI's prices down.

Either that or build a new platform.
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 11:53 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
Gigabyte should have some utility app for download on their site. Look up easy tune under the support section.

So P95 for an hour doesn't shut down your PC?
No P95, for an hour, did not.
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 12:18 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwright View Post
My mind told me I had asked about the OCing before so I searched my posts.

http://www.rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?t=33888061

I am going to give it a try again.

If you don't want to look at that thread, below are the settings I was using when the system reset itself.

Code:
CPU Clock Ratio- 8 <<<----CPU Multiplier
CPU Host Clock Control - [Enabled]
CPU Host Frequency (MHz) [400] <<<----FSB Speed
System Voltage Control - [Manual] 
DDR2 OverVoltage Control - [+0.300V] <-- default is 1.8V, 1.8 + 0.3V = 2.1V
PCI-E OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability 
FSB OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
OverVoltage Control - [+0.1V] <--- a little extra for stability
CPU voltage - E6400 = 1.35 (Normal CPU Vcore 1.3250V)
DRAM Timing Selectable - SPD -[Manual]
CAS Latency Time - 4
Dram RAS# to CAS# Delay - 4
Dram RAS# Precharge Delay - 4 
Precharge Delay (tRAS)- 12
Thanks!
Imo it isn't worth it to raise voltages for 200 MHz (the thread starts with a 3GHz o/c but I haven't read it all). I also think that in your 3.2GHz attempt you might have raised too many voltages (unless you've checked the need of each of them).

If you think or know that an FSB : DRAM 1:1 ratio is superior, I wouldn't mind leaving the memory underclocked at 750 MHz, or if it's overclocked, with less voltage. In this latter case I'd set all DRAM timings, even the secondary ones if you can access them, to higher values (except some that could be determined by the processor and not the frequency; it happened to me with four of them in my ancient system).

My mobo shows the default ones at stock speed. If yours can do it as well, you can calculate the proper latency as follows: stock latency x actual freq / stock freq, and round the result to a higher value always. This method respects each timer specification that comes in absolute terms (usually ns), but even respecting all timers cannot guarantee that a memory o/c is stable.

Dealing with memory timings might look boring and complicated, but unfortunately memory is more sensitive to tightened timings than to increased frequency, and the benefit is also much inferior.
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 01:47 PM   #23
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No P95, for an hour, did not.
Ahh, then try raising vcore til it at least passes that.
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 02:41 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
Ahh, then try raising vcore til it at least passes that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
So P95 for an hour doesn't shut down your PC?

No, I was saying running it for an hour does not shut down my PC

"Originally Posted by drwright "No P95, for an hour, did not (shut down my PC)."
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Old Feb 12, 2010, 05:04 PM   #25
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Let it run for longer and see if it crashes then? Little bit overkill but aim for say 12 hrs minimum.
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Old Feb 15, 2010, 10:30 AM   #26
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What mobo would you pair this with for gaming?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103656
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Old Feb 15, 2010, 10:57 AM   #27
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If you're asking me personally, I would defer to other members who have more experience with current-gen AMD stuff.

What happened to the overclocking though?
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please refrain from telling other forum members to "Go eat a buffet of dicks." in the future.

Thank you.

Regards,
mad"
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Old Feb 15, 2010, 11:27 AM   #28
caveman-jim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drwright View Post
What mobo would you pair this with for gaming?

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16819103656
If you know you will never need CrossfireX, then a board from Gigabyte, ASUS, ECS or Biostar with a 770/785 chipset.

If you want to have the CrossfireX options, then 790GX.
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Old Feb 15, 2010, 01:20 PM   #29
drwright
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zero View Post
If you're asking me personally, I would defer to other members who have more experience with current-gen AMD stuff.

What happened to the overclocking though?
I am still going to reattempt the oc'ing but I am also looking at other options

Quote:
Originally Posted by caveman-jim View Post
If you know you will never need CrossfireX, then a board from Gigabyte, ASUS, ECS or Biostar with a 770/785 chipset.

If you want to have the CrossfireX options, then 790GX.
Thank you. I will take a look at those boards.
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Old Feb 15, 2010, 04:09 PM   #30
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Is Gigabyte EasyTune a viable option for overclocking on my motherboard or is better to do it manually? Thanks
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