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Old May 14, 2021, 09:25 AM   #6001
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Ok, I will wear a mask for the kids for a few weeks to give them a chance to get vaccinated in the US!
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Old May 14, 2021, 10:06 AM   #6002
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We're wearing masks until our kids get the vaccine too.
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Old May 14, 2021, 12:19 PM   #6003
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Originally Posted by AllexxisF1 View Post
With only 34% of the country fully vaccinated I think this guidance is way too freaking early.

Those folks who are too lazy or too stupid to get the vaccine are going to be tossing their masks and celebrate with those who did. They're not going to wear masks or social distance and will give COVID-19 the playground it has been dreaming of.
...
Mark my words, two weeks after 4th of July, the **** is going to hit the fan.

Yes, but? Too early implies that if there was just a little more time you could get more people vaccinated. That isn't true. We're hitting the wall. We certainly will have exhausted every willing and/or persuadable person by July 4th.

Past that, the only thing that's going to change their mind is the fear of death when someone close to them gets it, and that happens only after the ****-show starts. The Administration knows it, and has made their peace with it as far as I can tell.
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Old May 14, 2021, 12:35 PM   #6004
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Originally Posted by MyTMouse View Post
One thing that few people seem to address is that a lot of this current Covid situation is a result of multiple levels of governments around the world refusing to do what would have mitigated a lot of this to begin with...complete and total shutdown of our borders. Most of the cases going around where I live are the UK variant which could have been totally avoided if we didn't allow any international travel. The same politicians who would have people locked up in their homes, while also not heeding their own orders oftentimes, gloss over border travel. With the way the world is connected now we don't need international travel for business, international vacations aren't necessary..we probably could have had this thing down a long time ago if our borders were taken care of properly
Agreed, it is such a simple solution but many won't do it. Our current admin has created a Pandoras Box down in the south allowing hoards of unknown people with many of them already confirmed infected into the country unchecked and is doing nothing to fix it. Doing this during a pandemic is mind blowing stupid.
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Old May 14, 2021, 01:44 PM   #6005
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The virus is here, shutting borders and blaming "others" or "foreigners" is just a waste of breath at this point. Especially considering that it never will be 100% shut off due to global trade...

It wouldn't have done anything to stop the virus from killing nearly 600k Americans because it isn't the reason that that many people died. Our lack of testing and a national strategy in the beginning is what set us on the course we are on today. The lack of masking, distancing, and taking it seriously is what compounded that original "sin." America failed itself. We cannot blame others. We cannot shift blame. We have to stop being snowflakes and take that... uh.... "personal accountability" so many drown on about.
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Old May 14, 2021, 02:58 PM   #6006
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Originally Posted by koralis View Post
Yes, but? Too early implies that if there was just a little more time you could get more people vaccinated. That isn't true. We're hitting the wall. We certainly will have exhausted every willing and/or persuadable person by July 4th.

Past that, the only thing that's going to change their mind is the fear of death when someone close to them gets it, and that happens only after the ****-show starts. The Administration knows it, and has made their peace with it as far as I can tell.
Well there's still folk reporting here that they just got their 2nd or soon will (which means they still have another 2-3 weeks til the finish line). I think waiting about another month was more prudent. But you're right by July 4 every adult that wants one would have been fully vaccinated by then.

That still leaves the question of places kids visit. With school out I've been noticing more rugrats at the grocery store. The store still has a mask policy so no worries for now.
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Old May 14, 2021, 05:01 PM   #6007
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New guidelines = infect anti-vaxers as quick as possible with virus. Guess that is a good way to get us to herd immunity. Because it wasn't going to happen with just vaccine.
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Old May 14, 2021, 06:03 PM   #6008
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Originally Posted by Jay20016 View Post
The virus is here, shutting borders and blaming "others" or "foreigners" is just a waste of breath at this point. Especially considering that it never will be 100% shut off due to global trade...

It wouldn't have done anything to stop the virus from killing nearly 600k Americans because it isn't the reason that that many people died. Our lack of testing and a national strategy in the beginning is what set us on the course we are on today. The lack of masking, distancing, and taking it seriously is what compounded that original "sin." America failed itself. We cannot blame others. We cannot shift blame. We have to stop being snowflakes and take that... uh.... "personal accountability" so many drown on about.
WRONG...China hiding the problem for so long and governments NOT closing the borders to international travel created this problem. I wonder if they'll be a little quicker to react next time this happens (there will be a next time).

In other news I got my Moderna shot earlier this afternoon and am increasingly having a craving for raw meat...come to think of it I've spent the last couple of hours watching all sorts of videos on brains....

...the lady who gave me the shot tried to get the vaccine in my arm in like 1/10th of a second...have had dozens of shots in my life and she wasn't very good at all
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Old May 14, 2021, 07:10 PM   #6009
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Dang. Yeah, the quicker they push the more intramuscular damage it causes and hence increased soreness. Sorry to hear your nurse/vaccine giver sucked
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Old May 14, 2021, 08:09 PM   #6010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyTMouse View Post
WRONG...China hiding the problem for so long and governments NOT closing the borders to international travel created this problem. I wonder if they'll be a little quicker to react next time this happens (there will be a next time).

In other news I got my Moderna shot earlier this afternoon and am increasingly having a craving for raw meat...come to think of it I've spent the last couple of hours watching all sorts of videos on brains....

...the lady who gave me the shot tried to get the vaccine in my arm in like 1/10th of a second...have had dozens of shots in my life and she wasn't very good at all
It’s a viral disease. You don’t know you should close your borders until it is too late and you have the infection. Are you suggesting the minute the virus was identified all countries should have ended all international travel and locked all borders. Describe what the economy would have looked like if this happened?
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Old May 14, 2021, 08:44 PM   #6011
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Government here announced that mask exemptions now require a doctors note. Not much will change though since retailers have done a poor job enforcing mask wearing, but it's a nice *Simpsons Nelson HAHA!* to the anti-maskers that have not been wearing one just to get a rise out of people.
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Old May 15, 2021, 06:07 AM   #6012
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Originally Posted by MyTMouse View Post
WRONG...China hiding the problem for so long and governments NOT closing the borders to international travel created this problem. I wonder if they'll be a little quicker to react next time this happens (there will be a next time).
So, it's all someone else's fault? We have no agency of our own? We did not exacerbate the risk by the lack of testing, lack of general sense of urgency, or need for a country wide coordinated response? It was all those pesky Chinese? Why is it that on December they were having their outbreak and it wasn't until mid March we did things? All the Chinese fault though, right?

Are there things they could've done differently? Yes. Were they 100% transparent? No. Did they, as most restrictive regimes to, try to save face and silence critics? Most definitely, but are they alone? No, look at what happened in our own country about transparency and saving face.... Our President was saying one thing privately and another thing publicly. Or, how about my governor hiding case count and other information of public need so that journalists had to sue for its release. Does that not have any share of the blame or scorn... Or are we only concerned with the original sin committed in China? I honestly think some of us just forget what it was like in the before time either through ignorance or hindsight....

This was a new virus, remember at the outset when it was being called the novel corona virus? It isn't a book, but rather, a new strain that had never been identified in humans before. With that comes research on the fly and the need to share information to find evidence for what ever proclamation the medical field would make. It isn't instant. It takes time to develop the hypothesis, find the evidence to support it, and then continue forward with more understanding. And this isn't some 9 to 5 lab research this is in the field with people's lives on the line...

Think back at what we knew then, or at least what we were told, because it seems Trump knew it was airborne in February, but the actual declaration wasn't until October 2020, over 7 months into the pandemic - with the final declaration happening a week ago from our own CDC... Is this all because they wanted us to get sick? No, it's because science takes time before you can unequivocally claim something as fact. Some here in this thread have had statements like: "They changed their mind" so they can't be trusted, which just shows off their scientific illiteracy.

But I digress, **** the Chinese.
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Old May 15, 2021, 08:03 AM   #6013
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NC more or less lifted all restrictions yesterday. Is it just me, or is it going to feel strange being in public without a mask on again? Since only about 50% of the population in NC is vaccinated now, there's no way this doesn't create a spike in cases. Guess that's one way to get closer to herd immunity.
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Old May 15, 2021, 08:31 AM   #6014
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It definitely felt weird as hell when I was in Texas and went to a restaurant and everyone was looking at us crazy for wearing masks. It's wild.
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Old May 15, 2021, 10:58 AM   #6015
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MyTMouse View Post
WRONG...China hiding the problem for so long and governments NOT closing the borders to international travel created this problem. I wonder if they'll be a little quicker to react next time this happens (there will be a next time).

In other news I got my Moderna shot earlier this afternoon and am increasingly having a craving for raw meat...come to think of it I've spent the last couple of hours watching all sorts of videos on brains....

...the lady who gave me the shot tried to get the vaccine in my arm in like 1/10th of a second...have had dozens of shots in my life and she wasn't very good at all
As Jay said China has some blame in how they handle the response but the biggest problem how long it took us to get it under control. It's delusional to think if China responded quicker the outcome would be different. The virus absolutely will get no matter how much faster they respond. It's already out and spreading by the time they detect it. People don't health check every 2 weeks. International travel created this problem but the blame can't be only on China. It spread because your country's pandemic protocol isn't any better than China's. Giving how resistant we are to lifestyle changes in a pandemic I don't see how getting info early would change anything because we didn't take it seriously 3months in.
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Old May 15, 2021, 12:11 PM   #6016
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay20016 View Post
So, it's all someone else's fault? We have no agency of our own? We did not exacerbate the risk by the lack of testing, lack of general sense of urgency, or need for a country wide coordinated response? It was all those pesky Chinese? Why is it that on December they were having their outbreak and it wasn't until mid March we did things? All the Chinese fault though, right?

Are there things they could've done differently? Yes. Were they 100% transparent? No. Did they, as most restrictive regimes to, try to save face and silence critics? Most definitely, but are they alone? No, look at what happened in our own country about transparency and saving face.... Our President was saying one thing privately and another thing publicly. Or, how about my governor hiding case count and other information of public need so that journalists had to sue for its release. Does that not have any share of the blame or scorn... Or are we only concerned with the original sin committed in China? I honestly think some of us just forget what it was like in the before time either through ignorance or hindsight....

This was a new virus, remember at the outset when it was being called the novel corona virus? It isn't a book, but rather, a new strain that had never been identified in humans before. With that comes research on the fly and the need to share information to find evidence for what ever proclamation the medical field would make. It isn't instant. It takes time to develop the hypothesis, find the evidence to support it, and then continue forward with more understanding. And this isn't some 9 to 5 lab research this is in the field with people's lives on the line...

Think back at what we knew then, or at least what we were told, because it seems Trump knew it was airborne in February, but the actual declaration wasn't until October 2020, over 7 months into the pandemic - with the final declaration happening a week ago from our own CDC... Is this all because they wanted us to get sick? No, it's because science takes time before you can unequivocally claim something as fact. Some here in this thread have had statements like: "They changed their mind" so they can't be trusted, which just shows off their scientific illiteracy.

But I digress, **** the Chinese.


they hid the facts, they let people fly out of wuhan to other countries but not to other parts of china and they could have locked it down
but i think the Chinese government wanted it to spread they knew they were F**ked so might as well F**k everyone else also
they have not changed since tiananmen square one bit and have no care for human life .


......
and no one had good testing at the start partly because they did not share all the facts and data



not saying **** the Chinese people anywhere but **** the Chinese government The Communist Party of China
the CPC is to blame for this .
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Old May 15, 2021, 02:04 PM   #6017
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they hid the facts, they let people fly out of wuhan to other countries but not to other parts of china and they could have locked it down
but i think the Chinese government wanted it to spread they knew they were F**ked so might as well F**k everyone else also
they have not changed since tiananmen square one bit and have no care for human life .

......
and no one had good testing at the start partly because they did not share all the facts and data



not saying **** the Chinese people anywhere but **** the Chinese government The Communist Party of China
the CPC is to blame for this .
What I find increasingly funny with all of the replies about blaming china is that you all do not see how every statement you make just shows all of us how ignorant you are towards the reality of Covid.

Yes, people fled countries in the lead up to the lockdowns, what point you're neglecting to remember (or are ignorant of) is that the majority of the cases we had were from the European strain of the virus. Do you remember when there was a panic at airports across Europe after Trump said that air travel would be restricted for 30 days? The lines of people who crowded the space in a last ditch effort to try and get home before they'd be forced to stay for 30 days? Oh, wait, actually, they would've still been able to travel anyhow due to them allowing U.S citizens to return home, so thus.... travel wasn't "cut" just restricted.... That confusion... resulted in more cases as everyone crammed into the airports in fear of being stuck abroad....

The predominant strain in the early months of the pandemic in the U.S was the European one. The one that ravaged New York was the European one. And yet, some 40% of their cases were from community spread before March 3rd.... Trump's travel ban was on March 11th. The virus was already here. It was already everywhere. No ban would've been the silver bullet....

As for testing. South Korea and the U.S had their first known case on the same day, Jan 20th. South Korea built the infrastructure to combat Covid. They ramped up testing with drive through testing sites, had massive contact tracing operations, and the government said that it would foot any bill incurred for testing and fighting the virus. They at one point were doing more testing in a day than what we were capable of doing cumulatively over the span of two weeks. They did what needed to be done to ensure their survival, we did not. We had faulty tests of our own creation and failed to approve the WHO one that other countries were deploying with great success.

The fact that so many Americans want to bask and celebrate in our mediocrity would be laughable if it weren't so god damned terrifying. Our hubris is what caused us to fail. We should've been able to knock this **** out of the park, and we failed, utterly. Our government failed. Our citizenry failed. We. Failed. Miserably. There were mistakes across all levels of government and our people were more concerned about individual inconveniences than the death of strangers.

33,000,000 known cases in the U.S alone since the start of this. Nearly 600,0000 deaths. All because of our hubris that still exists to this day. Our hesitance to mask up, distance, and stay at home are not the fault of China, the WHO, or anyone else. They are our failures. And unless we change the underlying cause of these problems, they will happen again, when this happens again.

But, 'Merika, **** YEAH!

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Old May 15, 2021, 04:19 PM   #6018
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@Jay20016 - but that would mean folks would have to admit that they were part of the problem and they can't do that because that's not what their "news" channel tells them to think.
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Old May 15, 2021, 06:08 PM   #6019
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@Jay20016 - but that would mean folks would have to admit that they were part of the problem and they can't do that because that's not what their "news" channel tells them to think.
"But, but, but, but..... The economy!!!!!!!!" And, "we can't stay shutdown forever!!!!!"

As if opening without putting the work in and no mitigation is just not a way to die by a thousand cuts. The biggest irony in the arguments like that are other countries did the work, had a short term pain, but came out with fractions of a percent compared to our cases and better contact tracing and testing systems so that they could open sooner with far fewer restrictions. Our half assed open at lower capacities and strict guidelines that most never followed meant that we just exponentially spread out the pain over the past year and a half... How many businesses closed as a result of the failure of our covid response? How many could have survived a month or so, but not the year?

The saddest part in this whole thing is that some people honestly believe we successfully fought back covid. That this mess was a win and not a travesty. That the loss of life that continues to this day was worth it...... While completely unaware how other modern nations make us look like ****ing idiots. Wave the flag. Be proud of the response while everyone else in the world laughs at your stupidity.

It is a good damned miracle that we have the effectiveness of the vaccines that we do on the time frame that we do, because my god... We wouldn't survive the 6th of 7th wave.
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Old May 15, 2021, 06:31 PM   #6020
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Old May 18, 2021, 09:55 AM   #6021
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Mask requirements at my workplace are lifted. "Just because" telework to stop entirely by June 1.

I think I saw 200 people yesterday, maybe 5 wore a mask.
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Old May 18, 2021, 10:29 AM   #6022
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Crawdaddy79 View Post
Mask requirements at my workplace are lifted. "Just because" telework to stop entirely by June 1.

I think I saw 200 people yesterday, maybe 5 wore a mask.
Still required where I work, though to be honest I'm so used to wearing them now I don't really care anymore.
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Old May 18, 2021, 11:33 AM   #6023
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Originally Posted by Crawdaddy79 View Post
Mask requirements at my workplace are lifted. "Just because" telework to stop entirely by June 1.

I think I saw 200 people yesterday, maybe 5 wore a mask.
Here almost everyone wears masks everywhere and it hasn't stopped our cases from being the highest ever for the past month or so. Once the variants started getting through our airports it started spreading like crazy (compared to the numbers we had before). Lots of people here wear masks but a lot aren't good ones and a lot of people don't have them fitted to their face properly
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Old May 18, 2021, 11:47 AM   #6024
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Well my brother just tested positive for the 2nd time for COVID, he was fully vaccinated with Moderna this time, was around someone who caught COVID again. Though not much to worry about since vaccinated, I guess he feels fine even though positive.
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Old May 18, 2021, 11:54 AM   #6025
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nascar24 View Post
Well my brother just tested positive for the 2nd time for COVID, he was fully vaccinated with Moderna this time, was around someone who caught COVID again. Though not much to worry about since vaccinated, I guess he feels fine even though positive.
let's hope you're right and he will be back on his feet soon.
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Old May 18, 2021, 11:57 AM   #6026
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let's hope you're right and he will be back on his feet soon.
Lets hope for all our sakes that people dont get very sick from catching it again and being vaccinated. As that will throw out the whole vaccinated thing.
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Old May 18, 2021, 12:47 PM   #6027
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nascar24 View Post
Well my brother just tested positive for the 2nd time for COVID, he was fully vaccinated with Moderna this time, was around someone who caught COVID again. Though not much to worry about since vaccinated, I guess he feels fine even though positive.
How long ago did he test positive? I remember when I tested positive I didn't feel anything until about 3 days later then I started to get ill. it's a slow progressing virus, not a freight train like the flu. Hopefully, him being vaccinated may prevent or at least lessen that part.
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Old May 18, 2021, 12:52 PM   #6028
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xCLAVEx View Post
How long ago did he test positive? I remember when I tested positive I didn't feel anything until about 3 days later then I started to get ill. it's a slow progressing virus, not a freight train like the flu. Hopefully, him being vaccinated may prevent or at least lessen that part.
Probably somewhere in the last 3 days. I guess we will see how well the vaccine protects against bad sickness. Seeing more and more people who have been vaccinated catching it. Question is how sick you end up getting.
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Old May 18, 2021, 06:24 PM   #6029
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100% proof against Hospitalizations. Much reduced severity even if you technically have it.

And with lower severity comes low viral load making it harder to spread to others.
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Old May 18, 2021, 07:22 PM   #6030
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He happens to be in Mexico on work and the 2nd time he has caught it while there, guess he is stuck in the hotel just like the last time he got it while there.
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