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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:20 PM   #361
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bill dennison
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Originally Posted by acroig View Post
Didn't you hear? No one cares about RT/DLSS on this forum.
about NV RT/DLSS no we don't

try nvidianews
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:23 PM   #362
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Originally Posted by LordHawkwind View Post
Gandalf this card was marketed by AMD, as a big disruptor in the 4K market. Most review conclusions are saying it's a beast at 1440p but it's price over the 3080 is miles off. Meh at 4K as you say.

I'm beginning to think that AMD are believing their own hype and pricing their products way above where they fit. At £700 this would be a slam dunk as the 6800XT would be at £600 and the 6800 at £500. At £1,000 it's DOA and that's before you look at stock shortages. No Nvidia owner would seriously buy this over the 3080 given the performance numbers and difference in price. Don't think an extra 6gb ram is worth that much. At 1440p even AMD owners like me see more value in the 3080/6800XT.

They have 0% market share in the enthusiast class so can't afford premium pricing if they want to start making traction in the market. Once your market share starts growing sure you can creep the price up but not from such a low starting point.

This is what they are doing with Zen 3 where they've seen market growth go to 22% so they hiked the launch costs of Zen 3 by £50. let's see how that pans out as it makes Zen 3 more costly than their Intel equivalents which will be interesting to watch, plus the stock shortages must be hurting them whereas load of Intel CPU's in stock.
I think we are looking at drivers and game optimizations where performance are concerned Example Battlefield V, they lost to the 3080 with the 6800xt, when it was released, that has changed, even at 4K. the 6800xt now beats the 3080, and is almost dead even with the 3090 at 4k, with the 6900xt ahead of them all. Now, I know that is just one game, but it is a game that AMD should have shined in on the release of the 6800xt, but it was losing to the 3080 at that time. Nothing has changed hardware side for the 6800xt, so the only answer is driver and game optimizations. I point that out because I suspect we will see the same in other titles.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...6900-xt/9.html

As for your price perspective, Nobody knows AMD's profit margin. They may have had to price them at this price point to make any money at all, we do not know. Specially in the year 2020. You can scream all you want that they shouldn't price them where they are at, or that shouldn't have raised the prices, but the reality is they may not have a choice in the matter short of selling them at a loss.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:36 PM   #363
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Originally Posted by acroig View Post
Didn't you hear? No one cares about RT/DLSS on this forum.
Like it. I think I'm taking a voluntary vacation anyway as I'm done with trying to buy a graphics card at the moment. As Riptide says too much crap to be worth it. Maybe leave it a few months and just chill out.

Personally I just think AMD completely fu**ed up these last three releases in a massive way. I was nailed on wanting to buy a 6800XT for up to £700 and a Zen 3 for £450/500 so basically £1,200 of easy money for AMD. No chance of either neither total BS.

Will definitely buy a 3080 if I can get one and not really bothered about Zen 3 anymore. If nothing happens and Ping Golf bring out out a new set of golf irons for around £1,500/£2,000 in March/April I know where my money is going.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:43 PM   #364
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post
about NV RT/DLSS no we don't
I know you got my point but just in case you didn't:

"Competition wise you're looking at 3080 up to 3090 levels of performance for the 6900 XT overall. Performance-wise we can safely state that this is a true Ultra HD capable product with current games. For raytracing that however is a different story. AMD grossly underestimated the importance of a DLSS like solution, even it was for competitive reasoning only. Added Tensor cores in hardware on the RTX series will always work out better for NVIDIA, no matter what angle you look at it from. AMD does have DirectML support pending, but that still needs to be run over the compute engine and cannot be offloaded towards some sort of Tensor cores so we predict that the performance hit for AMD would be significantly bigger. This however remains to be a hypothesis until we actually see that working in a version that also will need to offer DLSS2.0 comparable quality to be even remotely called valid. So no matter how we look at it, it'll cost AMD more performance whereas NVIDIA can offload its ML supersampling to the tensor cores. It's the sole reason why they implemented these specific DL/AI cores in the first place."

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_page...review,33.html

So yes, if you want the best image quality you do care about RT/DLSS (and whatever AMD will ultimately call their solution).
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:44 PM   #365
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Originally Posted by LordHawkwind View Post
Like it. I think I'm taking a voluntary vacation anyway as I'm done with trying to buy a graphics card at the moment. As Riptide says too much crap to be worth it. Maybe leave it a few months and just chill out.
2020 has been hard on our hobby. Too much demand, too little supply, too many scalpers.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 04:57 PM   #366
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Originally Posted by NWR_Midnight View Post
I think we are looking at drivers and game optimizations where performance are concerned Example Battlefield V, they lost to the 3080 with the 6800xt, when it was released, that has changed, even at 4K. the 6800xt now beats the 3080, and is almost dead even with the 3090 at 4k, with the 6900xt ahead of them all. Now, I know that is just one game, but it is a game that AMD should have shined in on the release of the 6800xt, but it was losing to the 3080 at that time. Nothing has changed hardware side for the 6800xt, so the only answer is driver and game optimizations. I point that out because I suspect we will see the same in other titles.

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...6900-xt/9.html

As for your price perspective, Nobody knows AMD's profit margin. They may have had to price them at this price point to make any money at all, we do not know. Specially in the year 2020. You can scream all you want that they shouldn't price them where they are at, or that shouldn't have raised the prices, but the reality is they may not have a choice in the matter short of selling them at a loss.
NWR you own an NVidia card so you're the TAM AMD are after. Please answer me one simple question without any BS just a yes or no.

Would you buy the 6900XT over the 3080? You're the customer you're not bothered about profit margins of either company you just want the best card you can buy. So please tell me.

No rhetoric just a simple answer. Mine is emphatically NO and I own an AMD card.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 05:00 PM   #367
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Coretek's review is on the more optimistic side. But I really hope they come out with Super Resolution sooner than later.



He mentions that industry says availability will be ample in the first quarter and thus we can hope prices will crawl down.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 05:16 PM   #368
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Could you add clarification to your words under your name?
Trolling under one's own user name is a new low.

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Hardware Unboxed compared far more games and 4k average for both the 6800XT/6900XT is lower. That's without any ray tracing.



Sorry Bill, 6900XT isn't going to save you for Cyberpunk 2077.
Cyberwoke 2077 Special Dildo Edition is going to disappoint a lot of you.
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Old Dec 8, 2020, 05:20 PM   #369
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NWR you own an NVidia card so you're the TAM AMD are after. Please answer me one simple question without any BS just a yes or no.

Would you buy the 6900XT over the 3080? You're the customer you're not bothered about profit margins of either company you just want the best card you can buy. So please tell me.

No rhetoric just a simple answer. Mine is emphatically NO and I own an AMD card.
You need to stop with your " you own a Nvidia card". The one in my machine in my system specs, is the first one in my gaming machine in 12 years, bought 9 months ago. You already had posts removed because of this crap. And yes, IF I was planning to buy another gpu, I would buy a 6800xt, or a 6900xt over a 3080 or a 3090 if my 34" Ultrawide monitor wasn't tied to gsync. Of course that has nothing to do with the discussion or my previous post.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 02:34 AM   #370
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Wasn't sure where to post this but an AMD sponsored title utilizing RDNA2 Ray Accelerator cores has updated the demo to include a benchmark.

Riftbreaker demo on steam. It looks quite good. Check it out.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 03:41 AM   #371
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6900xt is good if you only want to play games with no Ray Tracing, but if you're going to pay a grand for a high end card, and decide to not use any of the latest graphical features, that's fairly mind boggling to say it nicely.

It's like when I bought a x800 xtpe out of pure ignorance and was like goddamn my card being impossible to get and expensive is already out of date

When AMD actually makes dedicated cores for Ray Tracing, and they improve bandwidth as something is clearly choking at 4k, then they will be truly competitive.

For now it's basically almost but not quite enough. At least it's better than the last few cards they released anyway, and actually within similar timeframe as Nvidia and not 6 months later, so things are getting better.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 04:54 AM   #372
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AMD is OK at lite ray tracing, say ray traced shadows. Once you start adding all sorts of effects at the same time AMD struggles.

The effects in that game are done well for an early implementation.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 06:39 AM   #373
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Anyone saw that the 5700xt got a price bump ?
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:12 AM   #374
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Anyone saw that the 5700xt got a price bump ?
MSRP or supply/demand shenanigans?
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:28 AM   #375
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6900xt is good if you only want to play games with no Ray Tracing, but if you're going to pay a grand for a high end card, and decide to not use any of the latest graphical features, that's fairly mind boggling to say it nicely.

It's like when I bought a x800 xtpe out of pure ignorance and was like goddamn my card being impossible to get and expensive is already out of date

When AMD actually makes dedicated cores for Ray Tracing, and they improve bandwidth as something is clearly choking at 4k, then they will be truly competitive.

For now it's basically almost but not quite enough. At least it's better than the last few cards they released anyway, and actually within similar timeframe as Nvidia and not 6 months later, so things are getting better.

all the new RTX owners hyped on their new cards

and the 3090 can't do 60 FPS with RT in 2077 at 4k even with DLSS-P and only gets 54 fps

the 3080 gets 32.9 with DLSS-Q

at real 4k with RT the 3090 gets a smokin 19.8 fps and the 3080 gets 11.4 sorry that is just

the DRM removal will bump that up a bit but not that much


........

RT is great you turn it on lick all the pretty pictures for a hour or so at 30 FPU or less and then turn it way down or maybe off in 2077 case and play the game without stuttering

i have had to do this for 2+ years with a 2080 ti the few times RT was even ready and in the game at the games release and not 6 months late after you have played it
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:34 AM   #376
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Itd be cool if they could dynamically turn RT on and off as you enter action set pieces and slow going walk modes... So as to maintain minimum frame rate. Sort of like VRS. Use it when possible and needed but not always.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:46 AM   #377
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Itd be cool if they could dynamically turn RT on and off as you enter action set pieces and slow going walk modes... So as to maintain minimum frame rate. Sort of like VRS. Use it when possible and needed but not always.
like crysis 2 and it's over tessellation in it, I think NV it overdoing RT at the expense of FPS

maybe AMD can do the same type of driver fix for RT as they did for tessellation
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:48 AM   #378
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The game already has 5 different sliders for the RT effects, no one is forcing people to have them all at ultra.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 11:55 AM   #379
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like crysis 2 and it's over tessellation in it, I think NV it overdoing RT at the expense of FPS

maybe AMD can do the same type of driver fix for RT as they did for tessellation

Ya an automatic quality slider would be cool... Im not a fan of the manual toggles for some things.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 12:19 PM   #380
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like crysis 2 and it's over tessellation in it, I think NV it overdoing RT at the expense of FPS

maybe AMD can do the same type of driver fix for RT as they did for tessellation
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The game already has 5 different sliders for the RT effects, no one is forcing people to have them all at ultra.
nV needs a new driver and game needs patching, obviously.

Billy......
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 12:26 PM   #381
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nV needs a new driver and game needs patching, obviously.

Billy......
what i just loaded the new last second driver

now we need another


and that was about all RT games not just Dildo 2077
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 12:48 PM   #382
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what i just loaded the new last second driver

now we need another


and that was about all RT games not just Dildo 2077
Is your 6900XT doing any better? What? You couldn't get one? Silly goose.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 01:04 PM   #383
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Is your 6900XT doing any better? What? You couldn't get one? Silly goose.
I want Billy to turn on RT on his non existent 6900 XT and tell me what he gets.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 01:06 PM   #384
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I want Billy to turn on RT on his non existent 6900 XT and tell me what he gets.
He'll be playing with RT and DLSS on his 2080Ti, he doesn't need to worry.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 01:32 PM   #385
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I want Billy to turn on RT on his non existent 6900 XT and tell me what he gets.
357 MAG FPS at 4k
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 03:36 PM   #386
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You need to stop with your " you own a Nvidia card". The one in my machine in my system specs, is the first one in my gaming machine in 12 years, bought 9 months ago. You already had posts removed because of this crap. And yes, IF I was planning to buy another gpu, I would buy a 6800xt, or a 6900xt over a 3080 or a 3090 if my 34" Ultrawide monitor wasn't tied to gsync. Of course that has nothing to do with the discussion or my previous post.
I agree NWR and this is what I posted on the lack of thread....

"OK I would just like to profusely apologise for my unacceptable behaviour and posting last night. I was off work today so a combination of 8 pints of Belgian's finest lager (Stella Artois), Man United's appalling performance, tiredness and frustration got the better of me.

I can't even remember half the posts I did when I finally crawled out of bed at noon today. I'm not excusing my posts they were flat out wrong and I would like to apologise to anyone I may have offended especially Nigel G, Supergeil, NWR & Bill. It was unacceptable so please forgive me. As they say to err is human but to forgive is divine so I'm very sorry.

I've been a naughty boy and I shall sit on the naughty chair and face in the corner as a penance.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 03:50 PM   #387
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That had to have been a lot of Stella. If I go Belgium I get Delirium.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 04:02 PM   #388
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That had to have been a lot of Stella. If I go Belgium I get Delirium.
Imported Stella and 8 pints at 5.2%. Wow that Delirium I just looked it up it's 8.5% wow. Insane.

Stella Artois used to market itself under the slogan "reassuringly expensive" but became popularly known in Britain as the "wife beater" beer because of its high alcohol content and perceived connection with aggression and binge drinking. BTW I wouldn't beat the wife she scares me too much
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 04:21 PM   #389
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I agree NWR and this is what I posted on the lack of thread....

"OK I would just like to profusely apologise for my unacceptable behaviour and posting last night. I was off work today so a combination of 8 pints of Belgian's finest lager (Stella Artois), Man United's appalling performance, tiredness and frustration got the better of me.

I can't even remember half the posts I did when I finally crawled out of bed at noon today. I'm not excusing my posts they were flat out wrong and I would like to apologise to anyone I may have offended especially Nigel G, Supergeil, NWR & Bill. It was unacceptable so please forgive me. As they say to err is human but to forgive is divine so I'm very sorry.

I've been a naughty boy and I shall sit on the naughty chair and face in the corner as a penance.
No problem, man. At least you drink good beer and you are an AMD fan .

I feel like drinking a ton of beer myself these days with the difficulties of getting new gaming hardware these days.

But this AMD thread is getting overwhelmed with the one game Cyberdildo 2077.
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Old Dec 9, 2020, 04:30 PM   #390
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No problem, man. At least you drink good beer and you are an AMD fan .

I feel like drinking a ton of beer myself these days with the difficulties of getting new gaming hardware these days.

But this AMD thread is getting overwhelmed with the one game Cyberdildo 2077.
So sorry about last night I'm embarrassed. Thank you for understanding. Hopefully 2021 brings in a better year for all of us with regards to buying new hardware.

TBH I'll never buy Cyberpunk it's not the type of game I like to play. I play First Person Shooters on the PC with the keyboard and mouse, sports sims and driving games on the XboneX with the controller. I'm too old to use the controller on XboneX FPS games just can't do it
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