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Old Mar 26, 2021, 07:57 AM   #1
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Destroy
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Default VR is dying

VR is fun for about 100 hours. Reminds me of the Kinect, it has a strong newness factor. Trying all the different many things is neat.

Then you play a bunch you like but you get used to it and see the shortcomings; crappy graphics, annoying config, annoying setup, ease of use, comfort, tiring, clunky gameplay, imprecise control, bit mentally altered afterwards.

Add to that the ongoing 1.5 years of infuriating inability to buy any video card good enough to properly run the VR hardware.

Then there is Facebook forcing a walled garden; their products are basically another console.

I don't see VR doing well any time soon.

As fast as tech goes, this is one area that isn't advancing fast enough IMO.

/end rant
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Last edited by Destroy : Mar 26, 2021 at 08:50 AM. Reason: spelling
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 08:22 AM   #2
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I can't play 2D games any more, vr is just so much funner... just wish they had more titles...
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 08:36 AM   #3
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I like VR but for me the immersion is spoilt by the crappy graphics. I think it has a future when they can fix the things that's holding it back at the moment
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 09:00 AM   #4
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100 hours? I'm just shy of 1000 hours and still playing most days.


Driving games and sims without VR support are so much poorer that I wouldn't go back by choice. Even if nothing new for VR were to ever come out again the titles I've already got (AC, AMS, Truck Sim, DCS, IL2 etc) will keep my VR in use for a long time yet.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 10:08 AM   #5
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I think the thread title and OP don't match.

Yes, you can burn through all the current VR content that you like, and essentially 'finish' VR gaming... For now. Yes, there are a lot of obstacles to overcome. No, none of these indicate that VR as a peripheral is dying.

In my mind, a VR headset is a peripheral, not a platform. It's a bit like a steering wheel. You don't use it for every game, and sometimes you'll have a stretch of time where you don't use it at all. But whenever there's a new racing game for a wheel or cool new title for VR, it's there and it's easy to pick back up again.

I'm sure Alyx and PSVR have kickstarted a lot of VR developments, but they all take time. Any developer who saw Alyx and thought, "That's cool, let's build something like that!", is going to need at least three years to deliver a product.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 10:31 AM   #6
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It was always a gimmick thing. A "wow this is kinda neat" moment, but once the novelty wears off then it's back to the tried and true.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 10:39 AM   #7
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Saying that something is dying while facebook is selling millions of quests 2 is a bit odd.

It does feel like standalone VR has a brighter future than PCVR though.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 11:24 AM   #8
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VR is still in its infancy, both games and hardware. You need a beefy computer to run VR properly while looking good at the same time. At least 4K resolution and that times two, this requires a lot of power. The small screens aren't that good yet and 8K resolution would be even better. 4K is often enough for a monitor but looking through a magnifying lens which the VR headset really is puts another requirement on resolution. It also puts another requirement on framerates as low framrates cause visual confusion and dizzyness.

Then we have all the clutter with beacons in the room. A good pair of VR googles should have any extra equipment added to the room. Adding this limits the places you can use the VR set, so changing room isn't that easy.

VR has come a long way since the 90s but still has a far road ahead.

VR is more difficult as the bar is set much higher.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 12:09 PM   #9
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Of course we all expect future headsets with higher res, larger fov, wireless, etc., and those are all important. But I think there's some other improvements that alot of people don't consider that would make gigantic improvements to the experience.
  1. Experiences, not just games. Let me tour the Taj Mahal, or the monuments of ancient Greece. We need more of this kind of content, and higher quality too. There's been a few experiments in creating VR art museums, but we can do more.
  2. Make EVERYTHING multiplayer. Make it easy for 2 or more people to join in and play the same game, share the same experience. Why can't my wife and I sit on the Netflix couch together? We should be able to tour all the stuff I mentioned in my first point above, together.
  3. Let me create a virtual apartment and put meaningful stuff in it. There's been several of these projects now, where you can furnish a VR apartment and invite people to join you there. But I should be able to buy pinball and arcade games in it, and play them with my friends. Make it a meaningful hangout spot, that my friends will actually want to join me in.
  4. Support larger guardian sizes / play arenas. Seriously, VR is AMAZING in a large open space. Let's standardize on some large spaces that many people have access to. Give me basketball-court size games. Give me half-tennis-court size games. Allow devs to build games that work really well in these sizes. Support colocated multiplayer, so I can take some friends (each with a Quest headset) to an indoor basketball court, and play a VR game that's perfectly designed for multiplayer in a basketball court.
  5. Support alot more peripherals. There's already work being done on tracking keyboards, for use with handtracking. Let's extend that to recognizing driving wheels, game controllers, and whatever else. I'd love to see a pinball peripheral, that is just the front 6 inches of a pinball table that you can mount on your wall, so you can lean against it while you play VR pinball games.

All of these should be feasible with current Quest-style headsets. Just need much more mature software & platform support.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 12:45 PM   #10
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Default

It's strange that a game similar to Second Life hasn't popped up with dedicated VR support...seems like it would be a no brainer. Sansar looks like the closest thing to that sort of multiplayer experience.

I just don't think VR is ready for the mass market yet, the hardware is too demanding and expensive. You need a serious rig for anything beyond the basic Quest type headset and it's about impossible to get new components anywhere near MSRP right now.

I think the Windows Mixed Reality headsets were a nice middle ground, but they stopped making them far too quickly. I had one of the Acer models and it was fun to play with even with the noticeable screen-door effect and limited FOV.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 01:18 PM   #11
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I love my Quest. One of the coolest and funnest pieces of hardware I have bought in ages. I can still loose hours in that thing just surfing around google earth. And if don't feel like playing a quest game, I just connect the thing to my PC and away I go.... it's awesome, even with my ancient PC hardware

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It's strange that a game similar to Second Life hasn't popped up with dedicated VR support...seems like it would be a no brainer. Sansar looks like the closest thing to that sort of multiplayer experience.

I just don't think VR is ready for the mass market yet, the hardware is too demanding and expensive. You need a serious rig for anything beyond the basic Quest type headset and it's about impossible to get new components anywhere near MSRP right now.

I think the Windows Mixed Reality headsets were a nice middle ground, but they stopped making them far too quickly. I had one of the Acer models and it was fun to play with even with the noticeable screen-door effect and limited FOV.
It's called "VR Chat" and it's allot like Second life. Just take a peek at some YouTube vids of it.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 03:58 PM   #12
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Except that Quest 2 is selling millions. The platform is increasing etc etc
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 07:48 PM   #13
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When VR dies it is only because AR starts taking its place, just like how VR replaced 3D gaming. That won't be for a while and VR is growing in sales each year.

Some day we'll have holographic room scale VR without even need for a headset. Maybe a century or two or three from now. Too bad we'll all be bone dust by then.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 08:47 PM   #14
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considering sony just confirmed new VR for ps5, doesn't sound like its dying yet.
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Old Mar 26, 2021, 10:24 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SubCog View Post
Of course we all expect future headsets with higher res, larger fov, wireless, etc., and those are all important. But I think there's some other improvements that alot of people don't consider that would make gigantic improvements to the experience.

[Stuff]
...


All of these should be feasible with current Quest-style headsets. Just need much more mature software & platform support.
Having fun with Quest 2. Worth $300 IMO. I haven't used it unless I'm connected to PC.
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Old Mar 27, 2021, 12:39 AM   #16
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If VR is dying what was it last a year or two ago? Every year has seen an improvement for VR in terms of games available and headset quality.

The reality is that VR doesn't replace flat screen gaming. It's a different experience. It can be much more immersive and awesome, but the limited amount of games available, and some games not really being suited for VR, means that you're still going to play normal flat screen computer games. That is something that becomes apparent after you've played VR for a few dozen to a hundred hours. Personally, I don't see what's wrong with that?

If you're burned out on VR feel free to play some other games for a while, until something comes along that interests you. I don't agree that it's all just novelty that eventually wears off and you never want to use it again.

I doubt VR ever fully replaces flat screen gaming, at least not unless it gets to the point its so immersive it's like the holodeck. But even then computer games haven't replaced regular board games, so I see them always coexisting.
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Old Mar 27, 2021, 12:51 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destroy View Post
As fast as tech goes, this is one area that isn't advancing fast enough IMO.
Regarding this point, I think unfortunately VR is at the cutting edge of what technology is even capable of right now. The high price has always been an issue with adoption. In addition to that there are limits to how high res current headset size displays can be. The tech just isn't there for dramatically better products, and lower prices.

Personally, I feel like we've come a long way from the original Vive/Oculus Rift. If you've only gotten into VR more recently it may not be as apparent how much progress has been made.
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Old Mar 27, 2021, 02:20 AM   #18
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Love my og Quest and PSVR, one thing I do want is stand alone Quest with PC space/gtx but think the weight would need you to wear a neck brace or train like F1 drivers prior to using.

Not dead, slow and steady build if you ask me.
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Old Mar 27, 2021, 03:31 AM   #19
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We all know about lies, damn lies and statistics but the numbers would seem to suggest that VR is anything but dying. Steam VR use seems to have been climbing steadily with over 2 million connected headsets;


https://www.roadtovr.com/steam-surve...ion-milestone/
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Old Mar 27, 2021, 03:54 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thr0tt View Post
Love my og Quest and PSVR, one thing I do want is stand alone Quest with PC space/gtx but think the weight would need you to wear a neck brace or train like F1 drivers prior to using.
If you want a portable headset with PC VR quality graphics what you're looking for right now is basically a VR backpack. You can often pick up used Zotac VR backpacks on eBay for a big discount to original retail. As a niche product there apparently isn't a lot of people looking for them.

Definitely not enough power in mobile silicon to get that much performance into a headset that you could wear without breaking your neck.
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Old Mar 28, 2021, 05:31 PM   #21
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VR is far from dying. Others have shown articles, here is another one

https://techraptor.net/gaming/news/s...th-in-adoption

I feel like these "VR is dying" is similar to this

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Old Mar 28, 2021, 06:15 PM   #22
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I just picked up the PSVR set for my 11yr old son for his birthday(will be 12) next week.
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Old Mar 29, 2021, 07:41 AM   #23
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Here is one arguement about the shortcomings of VR.
And I should add, not suitable for work.


https://youtu.be/h8srG_iKh5Y
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Old Mar 29, 2021, 07:56 AM   #24
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As 3D TVs will tell you, sales does not equal adoption or success.
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Old Mar 29, 2021, 09:45 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Destroy View Post
As 3D TVs will tell you, sales does not equal adoption or success.
Uh, that doesn't work for your argument. 3D feature became a standard feature on TVs that were not the cheapest of cheapest TVs. I had a 3d TV for a long while, and I didn't buy that TV for the 3d feature, I bought it for it's other features and it was at a good price. I know a lot of people that bought a 3d TV that never used the 3d feature. I even have a monitor that can used with Nvidia's 3dvision, but I didn't buy the monitor because of that feature, I never used that feature, I bought that monitor for it's other features.

The same cannot be said about a VR headset, when buying a VR headset you are buying it for the VR, but for a TV the 3d Feature can be one of many features and you may not even be buying the 3d TV for the 3d feature.
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Old Mar 30, 2021, 11:41 AM   #26
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Yeah, VR is not dying

https://planetsmarts.com/2021/03/30/...uest-combined/

The VP of Facebook Reality Labs stated this:

Quote:
Well, looking at it, I think it’s starting right now. The fact that Oculus Quest 2 in just a few months on the market has sold more, not only than its predecessor, but all previous devices combined together, is tremendous.“.
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Old Mar 30, 2021, 01:33 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by Eisberg View Post
Yeah, VR is not dying

https://planetsmarts.com/2021/03/30/...uest-combined/

The VP of Facebook Reality Labs stated this:
The price tag probably helped in that respect
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Old Mar 30, 2021, 01:45 PM   #28
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I don't think VR is dying, but it's reaaaaally slow on the growth for sure. There's just not many games worth playing. I still don't have it and have been waiting until there is an actual list of games making it worth owning. The same thing I do for any console system, but VR is taking forever.

I agree and disagree with a few of the posts here.

We definitely need more experiences where you can tour and do different things. I just can't understand why that hasn't exploded. Tour a museum? Tour the great pyramids? Walk around Rome? I mean...why is this not a huge thing with VR? What a huge wasted opportunity. Especially with so many people home these days.

We need more real, actual games with substance. Most of the games remind me of the Wii era of 999999 games out there and most of them are mini game and random trash. It's a mess to sort through.
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Old Mar 30, 2021, 01:48 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by OverclockN' View Post
We definitely need more experiences where you can tour and do different things. I just can't understand why that hasn't exploded. Tour a museum? Tour the great pyramids? Walk around Rome? I mean...why is this not a huge thing with VR? What a huge wasted opportunity. Especially with so many people home these days.

There are a few pieces like this and I have a few VR galleries installed but I agree there should be more and better.
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Old Mar 30, 2021, 01:58 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by John C Flett View Post
There are a few pieces like this and I have a few VR galleries installed but I agree there should be more and better.
I think more people want to swing around an imaginary saber to music than to learn or explore something. That's the problem.
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