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Old Apr 3, 2019, 12:45 PM   #151
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methimpikehoses
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I had a feeling you were going to tell me there was something that could make everything harder.

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Old Apr 3, 2019, 12:45 PM   #152
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Lady butterfly is not a fight that really has lock-on issues. That’s besides the point that it’s still terribly designed, bad, awful .. I don’t know I need a thesaurus to find more words to describe how absolutely trash the camera is in this game.
Genichero? Third phase was awful

That was the worst for me, among several. that's where I think I damaged my controller...
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 12:46 PM   #153
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I had a feeling you were going to tell me there was something that could make everything harder.

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Old Apr 3, 2019, 01:12 PM   #154
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Genichero? Third phase was awful

That was the worst for me, among several. that's where I think I damaged my controller...
Omfg yes. Also lone phantom swordsman in the well ... I wanted to snap my ****ing controller in half. Abother bad one that I fought the camera on was the first miniboss when you’re getting to the Ashina depths. The soul throwing guy .. it’s like swhamini or something. Literally the most stupid fight ever. Not hard, but takes FOREVER because you have to sit behind a pillar for so long between his attacks. And when you’re behind the pillar it decides to randomly break target lock even if he’s close but broken LOS. Got me killed twice bc of that. I rage quit once on that fight. Lone phantom swordsman got me multiple times bc of camera
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 01:24 PM   #155
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Omfg yes. Also lone phantom swordsman in the well ... I wanted to snap my ****ing controller in half. Abother bad one that I fought the camera on was the first miniboss when you’re getting to the Ashina depths. The soul throwing guy .. it’s like swhamini or something. Literally the most stupid fight ever. Not hard, but takes FOREVER because you have to sit behind a pillar for so long between his attacks. And when you’re behind the pillar it decides to randomly break target lock even if he’s close but broken LOS. Got me killed twice bc of that. I rage quit once on that fight. Lone phantom swordsman got me multiple times bc of camera
The same ones I had the exact same issues and had to fight them unlocked. That ...I don't have a good word for how badly that sucked lol.

Meteor_Of_War -

I've watched videos to see if others had the same issues and most don't. Nunz and I both, same exact fights, man I hope you're one who doesn't have them. You already fought one of the guys Nunz mentioned, so maybe you'll be lucky.

But when its bad, it's really bad, Really bad lol.

Nunz - I had to walk away from the shaman or whatever the heck he is. I'll go back later, but man, that was infuriating.
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 02:07 PM   #156
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One thing I do have to admit: During some of the many long sword fights, that clashing of blades and music is just an epic combo, especially when the deflects/strikes are incoming fast. Love. It.
Yes its the most brilliant aspect of the game, IMO. The swordplay is just phenomenal.

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Lady butterfly is not a fight that really has lock-on issues. That’s besides the point that it’s still terribly designed, bad, awful .. I don’t know I need a thesaurus to find more words to describe how absolutely trash the camera is in this game.
Well that's the only fight I had any lock-on issues with so far. I also fought the lone phantom swordsman in the well, and killed the same enemy type on a side path in Hirata Estate as well. Camera and lock-on was fine for me.

I am now wondering, do you play with controller or mouse and keyboard? I know Lazy8s plays with controller, and you probably do as well. But just figured I'd ask. I have heard people saying mouse and keyboard controls are really bad in this game, worse than Dark Souls. Another thing, you may just be unknowingly tapping the lock-on button and unlocking it without realizing. The battles get pretty intense and I actually have that issue with the crouch button sometimes. I'll crouch in the middle of battle by accident which gets me killed a lot.
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 02:26 PM   #157
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Yes its the most brilliant aspect of the game, IMO. The swordplay is just phenomenal.



Well that's the only fight I had any lock-on issues with so far. I also fought the lone phantom swordsman in the well, and killed the same enemy type on a side path in Hirata Estate as well. Camera and lock-on was fine for me.

I am now wondering, do you play with controller or mouse and keyboard? I know Lazy8s plays with controller, and you probably do as well. But just figured I'd ask. I have heard people saying mouse and keyboard controls are really bad in this game, worse than Dark Souls. Another thing, you may just be unknowingly tapping the lock-on button and unlocking it without realizing. The battles get pretty intense and I actually have that issue with the crouch button sometimes. I'll crouch in the middle of battle by accident which gets me killed a lot.
I had major issues with crouch early on, but you fighting that guy in the well with no issues, you probably won't have many. I mentioned earlier a pro youtuber recommending fighting unlocked as he had the same issues...that's the fight I was referring to. It was unplayable locked for me.
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 03:59 PM   #158
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I had major issues with crouch early on, but you fighting that guy in the well with no issues, you probably won't have many. I mentioned earlier a pro youtuber recommending fighting unlocked as he had the same issues...that's the fight I was referring to. It was unplayable locked for me.
Yeah I've trained myself out of the crouch issue. Doesn't happen much now.

I can remember at some point after several playthroughs of Dark Souls, I started playing almost exclusively with no lock-on except for very particular situations (mainly parrying). Once I got comfortable enough with the game, lock on is really not a necessary help anymore for normal enemies, and if anything it becomes an impedance to the control. Its always nice to just quickly circle around a guy and slash him from the back before he has the chance to turn.

Wonder if eventually I'll get to that point in Sekiro. Maybe not since parrying is such a big part of this game.
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 04:39 PM   #159
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Yeah I've trained myself out of the crouch issue. Doesn't happen much now.

I can remember at some point after several playthroughs of Dark Souls, I started playing almost exclusively with no lock-on except for very particular situations (mainly parrying). Once I got comfortable enough with the game, lock on is really not a necessary help anymore for normal enemies, and if anything it becomes an impedance to the control. Its always nice to just quickly circle around a guy and slash him from the back before he has the chance to turn.

Wonder if eventually I'll get to that point in Sekiro. Maybe not since parrying is such a big part of this game.
Yep crouch isn't an issue for me any more. The lock on though, some enemies yes, unlocked is just fine, others, no way lol. Too fast in too large an area to control the fight without. Some though...got to take major care as the reticule likes to switch targets by itself if you aren't careful. That one cost me.

I just sat to get back in - I hit a second major milestone in the game, and a bit of the old excitement came back
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 06:15 PM   #160
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Found another non optional boss with severe lock on issues. Good thing is the arena is enormous so there's plenty of room to get away.

I have to say, other than the lock on and camera issue, what an amazing fight, maybe the best set one yet in terms of pure, bare knuckle knock down drag outs lol.

Like I said, some really memorable bosses in this game.
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Old Apr 3, 2019, 10:10 PM   #161
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If old man lazy8's, master of Dark Souls (at least compared to me) can't hack it, I would have zero chance.

Add a difficulty setting for people that want to play the game, but don't want to dedicate their lives to mastering it, From!
I am 100% awful at the game but still enjoy it. I just pick it up for an hour and try and learn one or two things about the boss that keeps destroying me. Sometimes, it takes me about 3 hours to beat some of these guys. But, it is challenging and different than most games. So I like it. For me, I just had to forget about the normal pace of advance and explore you get with most RPGs and just focus on combat and tactics. It is taking me forever to move through the game. But I quit caring about that and focus on the satisfaction of dispatching a bunch of enemies without taking damage or figuring out the right patterns to take down a boss. It's a painful learning process because sometimes it takes 15 minutes of area clearing to have another go at a boss. But, perfecting the whole thing is very satisfying in the end. You just have to focus on what the game is asking of you, not what you typically expect from most games.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 06:47 AM   #162
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I am 100% awful at the game but still enjoy it. I just pick it up for an hour and try and learn one or two things about the boss that keeps destroying me. Sometimes, it takes me about 3 hours to beat some of these guys. But, it is challenging and different than most games. So I like it. For me, I just had to forget about the normal pace of advance and explore you get with most RPGs and just focus on combat and tactics. It is taking me forever to move through the game. But I quit caring about that and focus on the satisfaction of dispatching a bunch of enemies without taking damage or figuring out the right patterns to take down a boss. It's a painful learning process because sometimes it takes 15 minutes of area clearing to have another go at a boss. But, perfecting the whole thing is very satisfying in the end. You just have to focus on what the game is asking of you, not what you typically expect from most games.
That's a good way to look at it. This is the first game in ages that made me doubt my ability to take down a boss, not to mention some of the mini-bosses. There's one mini I keep going back to over and over and I get a bit closer to killing it every time, but damn man

That being able to just eventually over power any enemy is another hang over from the Souls/Nioh formula that's gotten me killed many times in this one. It just isn't going to happen.

As frustrated as I am with the issues I'm having, I just cant seem to stay away from the game either. I won't be happy until I've seen every area FS has built in here - some are just spooky as all heck, some are just absolutely gorgeous. Screens you see online just don't do it justice.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 08:58 AM   #163
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It's a painful learning process because sometimes it takes 15 minutes of area clearing to have another go at a boss.
Not sure if you're aware but this is a good tip that applies in all of From Soft's Souls-like games, this one included. Once you know the enemy placement and quickest path back to a boss you can usually make a boss rush right back to it after a death. Its not unusual to take a good 30 minutes or so to first learn the area and make it to the boss room, but once you know exactly where it is you can run back to it and straight past all enemies in less than a minute. This is very useful if you're struggling with a boss fight, so you can get right back in the action while your last mistake is fresh in your mind. There is usually little need to kill the normal enemies leading up the boss all over again after each death. Well, with one exception in this game which is to build back up your resurrection meter but that only takes 1 or 2 kills I think.

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That's a good way to look at it. This is the first game in ages that made me doubt my ability to take down a boss, not to mention some of the mini-bosses. There's one mini I keep going back to over and over and I get a bit closer to killing it every time, but damn man

That being able to just eventually over power any enemy is another hang over from the Souls/Nioh formula that's gotten me killed many times in this one. It just isn't going to happen.

As frustrated as I am with the issues I'm having, I just cant seem to stay away from the game either. I won't be happy until I've seen every area FS has built in here - some are just spooky as all heck, some are just absolutely gorgeous. Screens you see online just don't do it justice.
Yeah I think FS finally got clever and designed a game that actually requires good combat skills like parrying/riposte. I think most people who played previous games got by with just over-leveling their character builds to OP status and powering through it. Seems they wanted to make a game that you simply can't just rely on doing that anymore, and its got a lot of players a bit pissed off.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 09:55 AM   #164
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Not sure if you're aware but this is a good tip that applies in all of From Soft's Souls-like games, this one included. Once you know the enemy placement and quickest path back to a boss you can usually make a boss rush right back to it after a death. Its not unusual to take a good 30 minutes or so to first learn the area and make it to the boss room, but once you know exactly where it is you can run back to it and straight past all enemies in less than a minute. This is very useful if you're struggling with a boss fight, so you can get right back in the action while your last mistake is fresh in your mind. There is usually little need to kill the normal enemies leading up the boss all over again after each death. Well, with one exception in this game which is to build back up your resurrection meter but that only takes 1 or 2 kills I think.



Yeah I think FS finally got clever and designed a game that actually requires good combat skills like parrying/riposte. I think most people who played previous games got by with just over-leveling their character builds to OP status and powering through it. Seems they wanted to make a game that you simply can't just rely on doing that anymore, and its got a lot of players a bit pissed off.
A little bit

The new combat is brilliant in another way as well. Previous uses of a "visceral strike" never gave any indication of how close you were to being able to pull one off. That posture break indicator literally taunts me in some fights, like another mini boss I found last night.

It's bar and mine were both just about pegged, one more deflect or strike and dammit it got me, but the tension is so real and in all the right ways just goads you into fighting harder, watching for tells more carefully....the stress in these fights is much more intense than any other game for me.

I may have found a solve for the camera issues too. Just simply stay away from walls/large structures. I don't know why, but if I can keep whatever I'm fighting away from the maps edges, everything stays smooth.

More testing on that tonight as the camera is horrible on the major boss I'm facing now, but the area is large enough to try to keep it away from the boundaries. Fingers crossed.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 10:05 AM   #165
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A little bit

The new combat is brilliant in another way as well. Previous uses of a "visceral strike" never gave any indication of how close you were to being able to pull one off. That posture break indicator literally taunts me in some fights, like another mini boss I found last night.

It's bar and mine were both just about pegged, one more deflect or strike and dammit it got me, but the tension is so real and in all the right ways just goads you into fighting harder, watching for tells more carefully....the stress in these fights is much more intense than any other game for me.

I may have found a solve for the camera issues too. Just simply stay away from walls/large structures. I don't know why, but if I can keep whatever I'm fighting away from the maps edges, everything stays smooth.

More testing on that tonight as the camera is horrible on the major boss I'm facing now, but the area is large enough to try to keep it away from the boundaries. Fingers crossed.
It might be worth checking out whatever settings options the game has for how the camera and lock-on behaves. I left everything at default so I'm not sure if there's something there that can change it.

I think Dark Souls had some option(s) for that so maybe.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 10:14 AM   #166
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It might be worth checking out whatever settings options the game has for how the camera and lock-on behaves. I left everything at default so I'm not sure if there's something there that can change it.

I think Dark Souls had some option(s) for that so maybe.
Oh heck you know I had some serious controller issues with DaS3 and forgot all about the steam profiles and settings? Dang man - thanks for the reminder, I will check that out tonight.

EDIT: Really quick google shows lots of folks having various controller problems from not working at all to only working partially, or just wonky like mine. Thanks buddy, you may have nailed it.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 10:21 AM   #167
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Who knows, maybe something settings-wise that could help.

Also, this is probably just anecdotal but for whatever reason I cannot play FS games with Xbox controllers. The analog sticks just have terrible precision compared to Playstation controllers. So the DS4 controller is always my go to and it never lets me down.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 02:29 PM   #168
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Yeah DS4 controller all the way for me. All settings are at default and I just fought a major and a mini boss twice each and confirmed it. Get next to a wall or structure and it goes crazy, get back into the open and it's fine.

I didn't lose those fights due to the camera though, as convenient as it would be to blame that lol. Every time I think my timing is tight, something comes along and tells me to tighten it up even more. Damn
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 02:54 PM   #169
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On your timing, I was wondering how you (and everyone in general) approaches the deflect mechanic in this game.

What I do when facing a tough enemy is hold L1 to always keep my sword up in defense, which will block their first strike then I'll instinctively let go of L1 and hold again quickly which almost always will get a well timed deflection on their next strike. I'll also do this successive times to get multiple quick deflections.

What I'm trying to say is you really don't need to have Jedi like timing in this game to do the parrying. You just have to hold L1 and get that first deflection, then release and tap L1 again quickly in sync with their next attacks. The parry timing comes naturally and I think a lot of players are over thinking getting the timing right.
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 03:03 PM   #170
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Originally Posted by Meteor_of_War View Post
On your timing, I was wondering how you (and everyone in general) approaches the deflect mechanic in this game.

What I do when facing a tough enemy is hold L1 to always keep my sword up in defense, which will block their first strike then I'll instinctively let go of L1 and hold again quickly which almost always will get a well timed deflection on their next strike. I'll also do this successive times to get multiple quick deflections.

What I'm trying to say is you really don't need to have Jedi like timing in this game to do the parrying. You just have to hold L1 and get that first deflection, then release and tap L1 again quickly in sync with their next attacks. The parry timing comes naturally and I think a lot of players are over thinking getting the timing right.
That's about right, until later

Quick deflects when under attack are the easist part for the most of it, but not all enemies give the luxury af the same type and timing of attacks. Like the two I just lost to lol
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Old Apr 4, 2019, 07:39 PM   #171
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Not sure if you're aware but this is a good tip that applies in all of From Soft's Souls-like games, this one included. Once you know the enemy placement and quickest path back to a boss you can usually make a boss rush right back to it after a death. Its not unusual to take a good 30 minutes or so to first learn the area and make it to the boss room, but once you know exactly where it is you can run back to it and straight past all enemies in less than a minute. This is very useful if you're struggling with a boss fight, so you can get right back in the action while your last mistake is fresh in your mind. There is usually little need to kill the normal enemies leading up the boss all over again after each death. Well, with one exception in this game which is to build back up your resurrection meter but that only takes 1 or 2 kills I think:
Yeah, I know that. I was talking about the Bosses that have like 6 or 7 guys all within aggro range. I don’t dare engage the boss until taking them down first. Maybe with more skill I could face a boss and a bunch of other guys. But not yet. It takes time to draw enemies away from the boss one by one and dispatch them. But that is part of the fun too as I often try and create strategies that can take them down one on one with stealth. Of course, the boss takes me out so many times I have plenty times to perfect my approach. I am truly the best at spreading Dragonrot.

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Old Apr 4, 2019, 09:36 PM   #172
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Took a break from the game yesterday but was back at it tonight. Made it to the Ashina Castle Upper Tower Antechamber. There's a seriously tough Ashina "Elite" up there that wooped me nice and good a few times before i had to call it for the night. I'll kill his ass tomorrow.

I was loving fighting those Nightjar Ninja on the rooftops. Bad ass ninja combat gameplay!

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Yeah, I know that. I was talking about the Bosses that have like 6 or 7 guys all within aggro range. I don’t dare engage the boss until taking them down first. Maybe with more skill I could face a boss and a bunch of other guys. But not yet. It takes time to draw enemies away from the boss one by one and dispatch them. But that is part of the fun too as I often try and create strategies that can take them down one on one with stealth. Of course, the boss takes me out so many times I have plenty times to perfect my approach. I am truly the best at spreading Dragonrot.
Ahh OK, yes i know what you're referring to. You definitely want to take out the little guys first, and quickly. I'd say just keep trying different things and find a strategy that works for you.
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 03:41 AM   #173
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Originally Posted by Meteor_of_War View Post
Took a break from the game yesterday but was back at it tonight. Made it to the Ashina Castle Upper Tower Antechamber. There's a seriously tough Ashina "Elite" up there that wooped me nice and good a few times before i had to call it for the night. I'll kill his ass tomorrow.

I was loving fighting those Nightjar Ninja on the rooftops. Bad ass ninja combat gameplay!

Ahh OK, yes i know what you're referring to. You definitely want to take out the little guys first, and quickly. I'd say just keep trying different things and find a strategy that works for you.
There's that weird FromSoft boss perspective at play - that was literally the easiest fight in the game so far

I'm at a spot now where I need a win. I have 3 mini bosses and 2 major bosses lined up and I'm a little frustrated as Fromsoft decided you have to have a certain item to hurt certain bosses, and you have to farm to get it, and it's a low drop rate, even with the possession ballons.

That's just un-necessary tedium as there doesn't seem to be enough just laying around the world or up for sale at merchants.
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 06:39 AM   #174
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Haven't played the game for quite some time. And, being too rusty (and just generally bad) I just spent a good 4 hours last night fighting the drunkard, then another 2 hours this morning on the Purple Ninja. Both are now down.

Holy feck! I'm getting gud too slow, help!
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 06:48 AM   #175
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Haven't played the game for quite some time. And, being too rusty (and just generally bad) I just spent a good 4 hours last night fighting the drunkard, then another 2 hours this morning on the Purple Ninja. Both are now down.

Holy feck! I'm getting gud too slow, help!
Sorry man, you have to keep bleeding out like the rest of us

I got a notice in my feed yesterday that someone posted video proof of beating every single boss in the game, zero hits taken. I watched some of it, then went off and just sulked for a while.

How many hours do some of these guys have in a day to get that damn good?
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 08:21 AM   #176
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There's that weird FromSoft boss perspective at play - that was literally the easiest fight in the game so far
Easiest fight for you huh? See, that's what i was talking about. For me his attack timing is quite different than what I'm used to from the other enemies so i need to make an adjustment. He doesn't seem too bad, I'll get him next time... I hope.

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How many hours do some of these guys have in a day to get that damn good?
Tons. So much so that if you actually saw how much they play, their skills start to not seem as impressive anymore.
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 08:40 AM   #177
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Easiest fight for you huh? See, that's what i was talking about. For me his attack timing is quite different than what I'm used to from the other enemies so i need to make an adjustment. He doesn't seem too bad, I'll get him next time... I hope.
That's what I meant earlier about needing to readjust for different enemies, and as annoying as it can be sometimes I'm glad FS changed it up the way they did. Granted their other games had the same changes between enemies, but the cost in this game is much higher in that you can die much faster here.

I literally started laughing when I realized how to take this guy down, 2nd attempt no cheese, but that doesn't translate to others, at all lol.

Quote:
Tons. So much so that if you actually saw how much they play, their skills start to not seem as impressive anymore.
True dat. I have the next 5 days off though and I'm close to the end so I'll be sinking some time in myself - just need to figure out the bastards stopping me from getting there
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 11:57 AM   #178
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Somebody released an easy mode mod already

I'm not linking it here, but the player can slow the bosses animation down and/or speed up their own, along with graphical tweaks. I'll try it if I don't beat the game by July
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 12:42 PM   #179
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Somebody released an easy mode mod already

I'm not linking it here, but the player can slow the bosses animation down and/or speed up their own, along with graphical tweaks. I'll try it if I don't beat the game by July
That's a cheat, not a mod!
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Old Apr 5, 2019, 12:52 PM   #180
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Hmm, so I was watching a bit of a let's play and realized I probably shouldn't have gone into Hirata Estate as soon as I acquired the Buddha bell thingie?

I mean there seems to be a lot of natural progression before the walkthrough guy (Fightincowboy) even goes into the Memory, which makes me think I was really "underleveled" for that area? I'm now at Lady Butterfly and wondering if I should even be attempting her before going further down the main progression line....
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