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Old Jan 7, 2020, 09:04 PM   #61
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bill dennison
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
If my FPS are slipping around between 35 and 90 it feels terrible even with Gysnc because the game is actually being rendered at differant speeds and you can feel it. For me, getting a perfectly stable frame rate is more important than a high refresh rate. I would rather play at a solid 30FPS than play at 30-45FPS.

Right now we can't get a stable 60FPS at 4K so it's not high on my list. I think the 3080TI will be able to hit that mark but stabalizing 80FPS minimums is still a ways away. When it's possible then I will be happy to take advantage of that with a higher refresh rate monitor and a frame limiter. Having a higher window as you described it is spot on and I see what you mean.

If SLI worked it would be more realistic later this year. Games like Stalker that are old and support SLI are hitting FPS limits down to 60FPS on the CPU due to a lack of multi threading and new games are GPU limited with little or no SLI support. Games keep getting more intensive and the demands usually boil down to playing at lower resolutions at higher refresh rates or playing at modern resolutions around 60FPS. The jump between 4K and 8K is large enough that it might be possible to hit 100FPS at 4K before 8K is playable so that will probably be the time I jump on it. It's never been high on my list but if the GPU and CPU power are there then I will make sure my monitor can take advantage of it at that time. With the few games that did support SLI this year I still had some GPU limitation but I also observed CPU limitations in the 70FPS range at 4K once the GPU limitations were removed so I don't think the performance will be there for me and what I want in terms of FPS stability until the entire PC system from top to bottom has moved on to the next level. I know people that feel a huge difference right now with frame rates that fly from 35 to 144 and they like it so it's probably just a personal preference on how much you get from it and when.


sorry I didn't mean in one game

more like

game 1 runs between say around 45 and 55 FPS game 2 runs between 60 to 70 and game 3 may run between 75 to 85 FPS and alike some games will run higher some lower

but the screens freesync window needs to be able to handle all of them

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Old Jan 7, 2020, 09:16 PM   #62
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Oops I thought you meant the window in which you get higher refresh rates. In that case we are not on the same page Still, I can agree with you that each game will have different performance and being able to optimize your limitations based on the game could allow for better FPS and take advantage of those higher refresh rates more or less based on what you are playing. I look at things in general usually. If most of my games are playable at 60FPS then that is what I look at. If the majority can be pushed at a stable 80FPS at the resolution I want to play at then that is when I would upgrade my monitor to support higher than 60FPS input.

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Old Jan 7, 2020, 09:54 PM   #63
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I've got a question for anyone who wants to throw in their two cents. What are your expectations of the 3080TI? In terms of RTX improvements, SLI support, rasterization performance, HDMI 2.1, Video RAM speed and density as well as price.

What are your honest opinions on where these things should be and where you think they will land? I'm just curious what the general masses of gamers want from these cards and what they realistically expect over the next year. What matters most to to you?
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Old Jan 7, 2020, 10:53 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
I've got a question for anyone who wants to throw in their two cents. What are your expectations of the 3080TI? In terms of RTX improvements, SLI support, rasterization performance, HDMI 2.1, Video RAM speed and density as well as price.

What are your honest opinions on where these things should be and where you think they will land? I'm just curious what the general masses of gamers want from these cards and what they realistically expect over the next year. What matters most to to you?
25% over a 2080 ti maybe 30%

RTX improvements maybe 40%

and 1499 since it looks like AMD has nothing this year

and normal old SLI/CFX is dead .

a MCM GPU may work a little like SLI but on one big memory pool of HBM with 2,3 or 4 GPU chiplets
AMD should have the edge here

but I think a MCM card is late next year
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Old Jan 7, 2020, 11:06 PM   #65
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AMD will match NV this year in the GPU depot. Just have to wait until later.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 03:23 PM   #66
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Its close already:



Consider both the price and transistor budget. AMD can pass Nvidia this year even if the 3000 on 7nm gen comes out earlier.

And at other resolutions its about the same story:

https://www.gpucheck.com/compare/amd...8700k-3-70ghz/

Diff is higher at 4k than 1080p so... And at 18.6 billion vs 10.3 billion trannies amd has much better perf per tranny. Nvidia is only really impressive at power useage.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 04:26 PM   #67
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
I've got a question for anyone who wants to throw in their two cents. What are your expectations of the 3080TI? In terms of RTX improvements, SLI support, rasterization performance, HDMI 2.1, Video RAM speed and density as well as price.

What are your honest opinions on where these things should be and where you think they will land? I'm just curious what the general masses of gamers want from these cards and what they realistically expect over the next year. What matters most to to you?
I did hear that the 3xxx series may be a good performance series, don't know about msrp's.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 04:39 PM   #68
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Originally Posted by pax View Post
Its close already:



Consider both the price and transistor budget. AMD can pass Nvidia this year even if the 3000 on 7nm gen comes out earlier.

And at other resolutions its about the same story:

https://www.gpucheck.com/compare/amd...8700k-3-70ghz/

Diff is higher at 4k than 1080p so... And at 18.6 billion vs 10.3 billion trannies amd has much better perf per tranny. Nvidia is only really impressive at power useage.
Wait, what? Are we watching the same benchmarking vid? That didn't look close at all, at any point.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 04:55 PM   #69
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I did hear that the 3xxx series may be a good performance series, don't know about msrp's.
NVs MSRPs all depend on AMD. Fingers crossed that big Navi does damage.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:45 PM   #70
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NVs MSRPs all depend on AMD. Fingers crossed that big Navi does damage.
Are you planning on purchasing an AMD card later this year if they make a new one?
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:49 PM   #71
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No.

That said, I'm also hoping Intels GPUs do damage to both AMD and NV line up.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:51 PM   #72
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Wait, what? Are we watching the same benchmarking vid? That didn't look close at all, at any point.
30% faster for 300% higher price... Thats close enough to me.

My take is an 800$ Big Navi would be 20-30% faster than the 2080ti for 2/3rds the price at this rate
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:51 PM   #73
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Originally Posted by bill dennison View Post
25% over a 2080 ti maybe 30%

RTX improvements maybe 40%

and 1499 since it looks like AMD has nothing this year

and normal old SLI/CFX is dead .

a MCM GPU may work a little like SLI but on one big memory pool of HBM with 2,3 or 4 GPU chiplets
AMD should have the edge here

but I think a MCM card is late next year
I'm thinking RTX 30%
Rasterization 30%
HDMI 2.1
16GB VRAM
I think if Nvidia could improve SLI they would talk about it. Currently they are quiet which makes me think it will stay down for this generation as well. Unless they surprise us.
I think the price will be 1000 direct from Nvidia. I think they will forego the a$$hole tax this time however they will run out quick and prices will skyrocket again. 3rd Party venders will charge between 1200 and 1400 for their versions of the cards with bigger heatsinks and an extra fan.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:52 PM   #74
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No.

That said, I'm also hoping Intels GPUs do damage to both AMD and NV line up.
You and me both.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 05:53 PM   #75
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Originally Posted by pax View Post
30% faster for 300% higher price... Thats close enough to me.

My take is an 800$ Big Navi would be 20-30% faster than the 2080ti for 2/3rds the price at this rate
OK, I suppose that's fair.

To me, the performance wasn't even close. But yeah, it's totally subjective and up to each of us to determine what that performance is worth.

If the AMD is faster and that much cheaper...you know what? Sign me up.
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 06:53 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pax View Post
Its close already:



Consider both the price and transistor budget. AMD can pass Nvidia this year even if the 3000 on 7nm gen comes out earlier.

And at other resolutions its about the same story:

https://www.gpucheck.com/compare/amd...8700k-3-70ghz/

Diff is higher at 4k than 1080p so... And at 18.6 billion vs 10.3 billion trannies amd has much better perf per tranny. Nvidia is only really impressive at power useage.
https://www.guru3d.com/articles_page...review,20.html

https://www.guru3d.com/articles_page...review,22.html



it is not even in the same ballpark .

the 5700 xt is slower at 4k than the 1080 ti and the radeon 7 in most all games other than a very few driving games

and the 2080 ti is 30% faster than the 1080 ti

comes down to this in most games at ultra or max in game settings with no AA the 5700 xt in not in the playable range of FPS
and the 2080 ti is even with light to full AA depending on the game


if CFX still worked I would buy two radeon 7's before two 5700 xt's
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Old Jan 8, 2020, 06:58 PM   #77
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saying the 5700xt is "close" to the 2080ti is absurd. that is complete delusion.

throwing more transistors at the problem is not the solution either. if it was that easy dont you think amd would have done that already ....
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Old Jan 11, 2020, 01:14 AM   #78
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Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
If my FPS are slipping around between 35 and 90 it feels terrible even with Gysnc because the game is actually being rendered at differant speeds and you can feel it. For me, getting a perfectly stable frame rate is more important than a high refresh rate. I would rather play at a solid 30FPS than play at 30-45FPS.
I've actually noticed that even fluctuations from 150 fps down to 120 fps feel bad. The change in frame rate is very noticeable, even if you are still getting high FPS overall. That's one reason why I have started simply capping my FPS at 120 in a lot of games. It's a smoother experience getting a stable 120 fps, than FPS that's 150 or 165, but then sometimes drops down to 130 or 120.

Quote:
Originally Posted by the_sextein View Post
I've got a question for anyone who wants to throw in their two cents. What are your expectations of the 3080TI? In terms of RTX improvements, SLI support, rasterization performance, HDMI 2.1, Video RAM speed and density as well as price.

What are your honest opinions on where these things should be and where you think they will land? I'm just curious what the general masses of gamers want from these cards and what they realistically expect over the next year. What matters most to to you?
I'm feeling pretty pessimistic. Based on last gen, my expectations are basically 3080 Ti being a 30% improvement over 2080 Ti, with the 3080 non-Ti being like 5-10% faster.

Both will show big RTX improvements. I don't even want to throw out numbers because I have no idea, but I'd say at least 50% improvement. But with so much of the die being devoted to RTX, the normal rasterization performance won't increase that much.

To be honest, at this point I'm not even in the market for a 3080 Ti anyway. I'm not having any performance issues with my 2080 Ti, and even in VR I'm doing fine with my 1080 Ti. So, even if it's 50% faster I see no reason to upgrade at all, especially since it will probably be overpriced again.
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Old Jan 11, 2020, 09:45 PM   #79
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I've been pessimistic ever since the RTX cards were announced as well. However, I am in the market for new cards. It will probably be 3.5 years since I purchased a new set of cards and I just tore down my old cooling loop and decided to leave the old cards out until this spring. This gives me some time to disconnect and get some things done around the house while saving up some cash.

Of course I hope they will deliver something special this time around but based on what happened last time, I don't expect it. My hope is that 7nm will bring in higher clocks and better performance. Since RTX is Nvidia's sales pitch, I also figure RTX performance will see a heavy boost but I'm keeping my expectations in check. Considering AMD delivered 16GB of video RAM, I'm thinking Nvidia will respond on their highest level card so I'm fully expecting 16GB of VRAM this time and I hope I'm correct because I have a use for all that RAM with DAZ studio.

I agree with the frame limiter. When I do move up to 120hz or more, limiting the frame rate to the minimums will be common practice for me.
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Old Jan 12, 2020, 08:51 PM   #80
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So this card is April or June?
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Old Jan 12, 2020, 10:21 PM   #81
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So this card is April or June?
September for the 3080

December for the 3080 ti
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Old Jan 13, 2020, 08:27 AM   #82
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So this card is April or June?
Rumored announcement is end of March at GTC. This could just be workstation variants though.

Availability is probably Q3. Unknown if we will get the 3080Ti at the same time as the rest of the lineup.
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Old Jan 13, 2020, 04:27 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Hapatingjaky View Post
Rumored announcement is end of March at GTC. This could just be workstation variants though.

Availability is probably Q3. Unknown if we will get the 3080Ti at the same time as the rest of the lineup.
whenever it hits he will say


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Old Jan 13, 2020, 07:27 PM   #84
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He just won't want to pay taxes.
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Old Jan 14, 2020, 08:45 PM   #85
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Yeah in hindsight I could have picked up the 2080 Ti a year+ ago but to be honest, sticking to my guns about price wasn’t too bad either.
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Old Jan 14, 2020, 09:23 PM   #86
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Old Jan 14, 2020, 10:08 PM   #87
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Old Jan 15, 2020, 10:40 AM   #88
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Oh man, that's great.
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Old Jan 15, 2020, 10:47 AM   #89
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Brutal!
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Old Jan 15, 2020, 04:47 PM   #90
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lol
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