The Sandman by Neil Gaiman - Netflix show

If they're going to continue the show, they need to maintain the same budget. The last thing we want is another Altered Carbon debacle. Go big or go home.
 
SubCog said:
If they're going to continue the show, they need to maintain the same budget. The last thing we want is another Altered Carbon debacle. Go big or go home.
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I don't think the budget was the issue, Mackie just could not carry the show.
 
koralis said:
Viewership dropped after the change. Both things can be true.
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But would viewership have dropped if season 2 had the same budget/quality as season 1?

Clearly fewer people watched it after the change, since it wasn't nearly as good. That's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy there.
 
SubCog said:
But would viewership have dropped if season 2 had the same budget/quality as season 1?

Clearly fewer people watched it after the change, since it wasn't nearly as good. That's a bit of a self-fulfilling prophesy there.
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The 'quality' issue for me was not a lack of money (it showed though) but Mackie just was not a good a lead nor was the story as engaging.
 
acroig said:
The 'quality' issue for me was not a lack of money (it showed though) but Mackie just was not a good a lead nor was the story as engaging.
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I suspect that Mackie was cheaper than Joel Kinnaman. Kinnaman cost too much, and Netflix didn't want to spend that much.
 
acroig said:
Perhaps, show just didn't feel the same with him.
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I agree, Mackie didn't carry the show as well. But the lower production values also made a big difference to the "feel" of the show... and since the choice to cast Mackie was almost certainly a budgetary decision, they are closely linked.

Imagine though, an alternate universe where Mackie had starred, but season 2 maintained the high production values from the first season. Yes you're right, that something is still "off" a bit... but I think it's MUCH closer.
 
Can you imagine the black eye if Sandman went to AppleTV or other competitor because they're being cheap? WB (HBO) might be happy to bring Sandman back into the fold now that it's proven itself.


Hopefuls on Twitter wondered if there was any chance of the series being picked up elsewhere.

Gaiman has only one concise answer for them: "Yes." High budget or not, Gaiman is determined that this is not the end for Morpheus and the story of the Endless.
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I think it's pretty clear he's had offers if Netflix turns him down or lowballs him. The whole "we might not get a season 2" thing might have been designed to entice offers, as far as that goes. :)
 
So further interviews make it clear that in addition to viewership (top 10?) they also look at completion rates (if a bunch of people start watching, and half of them walk away, that's not good) hence looking at things after 1 month to see if it's just taking people time to finish.

For what it's worth, Locke and Key were rewarded a season 2 after spending 5 weeks in the Top 10. Here's where we are today for the US.


https://top10.netflix.com/united-states/tv

Code: 
#	
TV
Dropdown arrow
IN THE UNITED STATES	           WEEKS IN TOP 10
1	The Sandman: Season 1	        3
2	Never Have I Ever: Season 3	2
3	Echoes: Limited Series	        1
4	Stranger Things 4	                13
5	Locke & Key: Season 3	        2
6	Virgin River: Season 4	        5
7	Instant Dream Home: Season 1	1
8	Riverdale: Season 6	                2
9	Extraordinary Attorney Woo: Season 1	    2
10	High Heat: Season 1	                1

Sandman
Top 10 in TV in 91 countries on Netflix

Never Have I Ever
Top 10 in TV in 86 countries on Netflix

Echoes
Top 10 in TV in 31 countries on Netflix

Stanger Things Season 4
Top 10 in TV in 56 countries on Netflix

Locke and Key
Top 10 in TV in 60 countries on Netflix

Virgin River
Top 10 in TV in 21 countries on Netflix




Stranger Things Season 4 STILL in the top 5 13 weeks later... guess that's why it's worth the crazy money to them.
 
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https://arstechnica.com/gaming/2022...-the-sandman-is-the-stuff-dreams-are-made-of/

As for Lucifer, most hardcore Sandman fans know the graphic novel version was basically inspired by David Bowie, and a few felt moved to point this out to defend their objection to Christie's casting. "Dude. This is going to hurt, but David Bowie's dead,"


I did not know Bowie inspired that role! Anyways the the review is heavy spoilers for the show so don't read unless you've seen it all. Apparently they cut out quite a bit of blood and gore out compared to the comic! I think it was for the best as the diner episode was most disturbing.
 
Well, viewership is starting to slow with time (not unexpected) but Sandman is still doing well. (Echoes is pretty awful... not sure why it's so highly ranked.)

Code: 
RANK                                 WEEKS  VIEWING HRS
1	Echoes: Limited Series	        2   68,490,000
2	The Sandman: Season 1	        4   53,790,000
3	Never Have I Ever: Season 3	3   25,640,000
...
8	Locke & Key: Season 3	        3   14,630,000


Looks like it has more staying power than Lock & Key. A couple of countries have moved on.

Code: 
Top 10 in TV in 89 countries on Netflix
 
hadn't read this interview/article. Nothing hugely surprising, but confirms that he's seeing good numbers/feedback. They can't reach inside the Netflixotron Scorometer to understand if it's good enough for the streamer's algorithm.


https://comicbook.com/dc/news/neil-gaiman-the-sandman-season-2-renewal-spoilers-netflix/

has been praised by many viewers, and has ended up having an impressive performance in Netflix's analytics. Still, the series has yet to be officially renewed for a second season — but according to Gaiman, the streaming numbers for the first season are definitely "looking great."

"Basically, the way that it works is making something like Sandman is incredibly expensive," Gaiman explained in a recent interview with Rolling Stone. "This is not a cheap show. This is the opposite of a cheap show. This is dead expensive. And that means that in order to be renewed, we have to perform as well as everybody could possibly, possibly hope. So everybody is very hopeful. It's all looking great. We're certainly on track for it. But it's all about how we do over the month after release."

"Well, you get breadcrumbs, and much more importantly, most of the breadcrumbs that they give you are things that you can check publicly," Gaiman continued. "I think last week, human beings on the face of this planet spent 127 million hours watching Sandman. That is an awful lot of Sandman. And the next-most-watched thing was watched for 65 million hours or whatever. So we're doing well. We're really doing great."



Gaiman did reassert that, if Netflix did not end up renewing the series for a second season, there would still be other avenues for the show to continue.

"Back when we put the deal together, we made sure that there were ways to continue with Sandman. But we also all hoped that none of them would possibly be necessary, because we love our Netflix people and they love us. And they've been amazing. I mean, they even made a secret 11th episode of Sandman."
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And
https://gizmodo.com/sandman-netflix-season-2-1849497778
The Sandman
According to a new post on the WGA Directory (via Spoiler TV), it also appears The Sandman has been quietly renewed for a second season at Netflix. More as it develops!
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Doesn't necessarily mean it's for Netflix, but an indication that it's continuing in some fashion and they're not hanging up their hats.

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https://directories.wga.org/project/1217265/the-sandman

One indication that this isn't just a copy and paste is that season 2 doesn't list
Lauren Bello Story Editor
or any story editor for that matter.

And the order of exectutive producers changed:

Season 1: 2021-2022
Allan Heinberg Showrunner
Allan Heinberg Executive Producer
Neil Gaiman Executive Producer
David Goyer Executive Producer

Season 2: 2022-2023
Allan Heinberg Showrunner
Neil Gaiman Executive Producer
Allan Heinberg Executive Producer
David Goyer Executive Producer


The lack of a netflix announcement, and this silent work-in-progress stuff makes me think that Netflix has passed and they're finalizing a deal with someone else and everyone is keeping mum about it under NDA till it's all settled. Just a gut feeling on the matter.



Lauren Bello was apparently the writer of Sound of her Wings. If she's out for season 2, that'd be a shame.
 
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Sandman viewership update:

https://top10.netflix.com/tv

#5 Sandman, 6 weeks in the top 10, 19,590,000 hrs viewed that week.


Stanger things 4, #8 and 16 weeks in the top ten with 16,560,000 hrs
Echos, which had been #1 for a while is down at #9 with 14,260,000 hrs.
 
Might be the last week that Sandman is in the top 10. Dropped below Stranger Things season 4 for the first time since release.

Code: 
#10    The Sandman: Season 1     12,220,000 hrs   7th week
 
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